Important Request: Your input needed regarding the "Newbie Forum"

[Paul A Andrews]

I favour merging. Being a relatively new turner I too had the issue of where to post. At the end of the day I usually based my decision on whether it was a basic question or not, and that's not really a good thing. I want to hear from the experienced people. The newbie forum creates two classes of posers. The general forum would meet everybody's needs, besides, its good to get reminded of the ABCs every now and then.

 

[Gary Beasley]

One forum I visit has a place under the avatar to advertise your status, I have mine set as Senior Sawdust Sweeper. That might be a more apprpriate place as it will follow your every post until you feel good about claiming some experience points and change it.

 

[Owen Lowe]

...creates two classes of posers.

Hey! I resemble that remark!

 

[odie]

I'm one who feels there is value in the old newbie forum. It was a place to discuss, that did take some effort to go there......whether participating, or not. That, in itself, made the newbie forum somewhat of a "road less traveled", that invited a little more long term contemplation. I've changed my vote to "no opinion".....(even though it is an opinion! )

How about first changing the name of the newbie forum on a trial basis?

Then discuss a merger at a later date, if it's still an option.

====================

If that can be considered, then coming up with the most all-inclusive, and appropriate name could make, or break the newly named forum. One where all skill levels will feel comfortable posting, inviting discussion, but not to feel lectured on what is decidedly opinionated subjects. Maybe the name can be hashed out, if Bill wants to start discussion on that in another thread......

Everybody here is.....or was a newbie......so, each of us need to look at our own experiences, and decide what it is/was that makes/made us feel uncomfortable with entering discussion.....and, not do that to others. Everyone needs "their own space" to evolve in their own ways, and capacities. If a name can promote that, then it's a good thing.

-----odie-----

 

[Doug Rasmussen]

Seems like the vote was conclusive, 78% in favor of the move. Is it going to be moved Bill?

Thinking about it, if I was king of the forum I'd merge all the subforums down to the AAW one into the main forum.

 

[Bill Boehme]

If that can be considered, then coming up with the most all-inclusive, and appropriate name could make, or break the newly named forum. One where all skill levels will feel comfortable posting, inviting discussion, but not to feel lectured on what is decidedly opinionated subjects. Maybe the name can be hashed out, if Bill wants to start discussion on that in another thread......

I'll give you an A+ for reading my mind.

I have felt more weight than you can imagine and have taken each post to heart while pondering what direction would be best going forward. The poll result is overwhelmingly saying to merge the two forums. But, the decision isn't altogether something as simple as a popularity contest . . . and, akin to the "Like" button I'm concerned that the poll may have diminished participation in this very thoughtful discussion. I've concluded that this isn't a situation where the answer is right or wrong, but I believe that together we will arrive at an equitable answer.

Even though the poll has closed, I would like to continue this discussion about merging (or not) the two forums.

Meanwhile, I plan to start another thread, but I think it needs to delve a little deeper than a synonym for the somewhat pejorative term Newbie. IF we have two discussion forums, what will be the defining purpose for each of them and why should there be compartmentalization and is there sufficient interest to make it worthwhile. One thought that I have had is to have a forum on woodturning fundamentals somewhat along the lines of the newsletter of the same name. Save your comments about this for the other thread that I will start later today.

 

[Regis Galbach]

I'll give you an A+ for reading my mind.


Even though the poll has closed, I would like to continue this discussion about merging (or not) the two forums.

.

Along that direction, consider the following
- One group is a discussion of experience among members
- Second is a request for help with a "somewhat" specific area, tool, or technique.

I guess I'm up to 3 cents worth now.
Regis

 

[stu senator]

You could consider increasing the number of forums. Their could be a machinery, tool, technique, gossip, pens, bowl, spindle and many more I am sure others could think of.

Another method would be to put a topic, such as above, as a required header to all posts.

Stu

 

[Paul A Andrews]

I favour merging. Being a relatively new turner I too had the issue of where to post. At the end of the day I usually based my decision on whether it was a basic question or not, and that's not really a good thing. I want to hear from the experienced people. The newbie forum creates two classes of posers. The general forum would meet everybody's needs, besides, its good to get reminded of the ABCs every now and then.

I learned early on, in the wood shop that hooked me on turning in Arizona, that if I asked 10 guys in the shop a question I would get 8-10 different answers. I can make up my own mind, and make the mistakes that produce learning. Let me hear from all of them.

 

[William Rogers]

I think the title "Newbie" was what bothered me when I joined this fourm. If the title was something like "Getting Started" I feel I would have had a better understanding of the fourm intent. Either name change or merge is ok with me. I think I would use the fourm to post work that I want feedback. For instance a bowl and looking for feedback on how to improve fourm.

 

[Fred Belknap]

I like forums as a form of learning, in some ways it is better than learning at a masters feet (woodturners clubs). I had done a lot of turning before I attended my first meeting and realized that a lot of the things I do are looked down on in a patronizing way. Therefore I was reluctant to do any turning at the club. Thats not to say that I haven't learned a lot from the club members, but somethings I do differently and have no intentions of changing unless I find that they have a better, easier way of doing it. I am a newby in somethings and relative accomplished in others. Probably there are quit a few members that feel that the title (Newby) could apply to them in some aspects of woodturning. I don't think there should be a separate forum for Newbys. I almost never go to the Newby forum.

 

[odie]

I had done a lot of turning before I attended my first meeting and realized that a lot of the things I do are looked down on in a patronizing way. Therefore I was reluctant to do any turning at the club. Thats not to say that I haven't learned a lot from the club members, but somethings I do differently and have no intentions of changing

Fred.....I find that very profound, and I can relate wholeheartedly. There is a peculiar "group think" or what I've called "herd think" that pretty much dominates main stream thinking among woodturners. Right on these forums, I've been called out on my methods, because I don't conform to the current turning trends. This nonconformity is particularly evident with my usage of faceplates and traditional grinds......both which were the only way it was done, prior to the introduction of self-centering woodturning chucks and side ground gouges. I guess I cling to the old ways of doing things, while the herd has moved on. These herd thinkers believe they are on the "cutting edge" of the art.....and, if I'm not doing things the way the "herd" does it, it really doesn't matter what my results are.....I'm simply doing it the wrong way!

I think we are of similar thinking on this.......I have no intention of changing for the sake of conformity, because my results are the "bottom line" for me. If I'm getting the kind of results that give me a sense of satisfaction.....then there is no need to change course.

Of course, this doesn't mean that I'm not open to change, IF I feel it would result in an improvement......and, over the years, changes in my methods have happened consistently, and frequently.....and will continue to happen in the future. I am in control of my destiny, and will remain so.

-----odie-----

 

[Lamar Wright]

Fred.....I find that very profound, and I can relate wholeheartedly. There is a peculiar "group think" or what I've called "herd think" that pretty much dominates main stream thinking among woodturners. Right on these forums, I've been called out on my methods, because I don't conform to the current turning trends. This nonconformity is particularly evident with my usage of faceplates and traditional grinds......both which were the only way it was done, prior to the introduction of self-centering woodturning chucks and side ground gouges. I guess I cling to the old ways of doing things, while the herd has moved on. These herd thinkers believe they are on the "cutting edge" of the art.....and, if I'm not doing things the way the "herd" does it, it really doesn't matter what my results are.....I'm simply doing it the wrong way!

I think we are of similar thinking on this.......I have no intention of changing for the sake of conformity, because my results are the "bottom line" for me. If I'm getting the kind of results that give me a sense of satisfaction.....then there is no need to change course.

Of course, this doesn't mean that I'm not open to change, IF I feel it would result in an improvement......and, over the years, changes in my methods have happened consistently, and frequently.....and will continue to happen in the future. I am in control of my destiny, and will remain so.

-----odie-----

Odie... I understand your thinking. I feel the same way.. My thinking is that turners should do what works for them. Just like using a faceplate turning a dry warped bowl. I have tried many different ways and the faceplate works great for me. That said, I have learned a lot of good tips on this forum and I appreciate all the turners that share their tips. I pick and choose what works best for me and as for me, I am a newbie when it comes to bowl and platter turning and I really enjoy this venture very much when I get time to turn.

 

[hockenbery]

Every turner has to learn what works for them on the pieces they are making.

When people do exceptionally good work they tend to get invited to demonstrate, teach, and write articles.

The best bowl turners I have seen are Liam O’neil, Al Stirt, Mike Mahoney, Glenn Lucas, Trent Bosch, and David Ellsworth.
Their methods may not work for everyone. However anyone who learns any of their methods will succeed in bowl turning.
When someone gets a method that produces better results they will get invited to demonstrate, teach, and write articles.
Actually anyone 1/2 as good gets invited to demonstrate, teach, and write articles.

One caution is that techniques that work for you on one piece may not work on other types and sizes.
Techniques that produce acceptable results on a 12” bowl may not produce acceptable results on 20” bowls
Techniques that produce acceptable results in a 20” bowl are going to work well on 12” bowl.

Techniques that work on NE bowls may or may not work on cut rim bowls and vice versa.

I’m pretty good with the tools but I go oh! wow! When I watch Stirt, O’neil, Ellsworth, Mahoney, Lucas, Bosch......

 

[Bill Boehme]

Looking down on others can be a two-way street. Making disparaging characterizations about how we perceive others regardless of which side of an issue we take is not a good way to foster an environment intended for sharing information. So think about how you characterize others who might have a different approach to turning and whether that helps to create a friendly inviting environment to new members.

Having different preferences on techniques and tools is how woodturning continues to evolve. Openly exposing ourselves to these ideas is part of the never ending learning process. In the end, each and every one of us does things a little differently. That's no reason for assigning disparaging names to those who aren't like you.

I'll leave the thread open for any additional comments on merging the Newbie forum for a while longer. While drifting off topic is normal, in this case I would appreciate staying on topic.

 

[Doug Rasmussen]

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I'll leave the thread open for any additional comments on merging the Newbie forum for a while longer. While drifting off topic is normal, in this case I would appreciate staying on topic.

Bill, thanks for your work to make this forum better. I've learned a lot here and appreciate all you do.

As I said previously, if I was king of the world I'd merge all sub-forums together.

The reason is because a good many posts in the newbie forum are far from newbie issues, like the recent question about spindle run out on used lathes. Same with the introduction sub-forum, a recent poster's introduction included the topic of finishes for cold weather which might have been better in the general discussion forum.

The "tutorials and tips" sub-forum? "presenting information that my be useful to other turners", but isn't that the purpose of all the sub-forums?

IMO, there are too many choices as to what sub-forum is the proper place to post.

My all time favorite online forum, manufacturing related, has a number of sub-forums that are highly moderated. Post something in the wrong or unrelated sub-forum and it may likely be moved or locked. Start a thread with a non-descriptive title and it'll get locked or deleted. Discuss low quality offshore machinery and it'll be deleted. This requires lots of effort on the forum owner and forum members also. That forum differs from this one in a significant way, it's for-profit for the forum owner, he sells advertising. Without the "rules" that forum would not be able to attract the quality of advertisers and posters it does. And, in spite of the rules it's still a friendly forum. I fully realize that forum requires a great deal more effort than anyone here would be able to provide, but mention it only as a way multiple sub-forums can be successfully handled.