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New Powermatic 4224B vs Oneway 2436

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I've been having trouble finding anyone who has much direct exposure to the new powermatic 4224B lathe, and was wondering if anyone had any input as to whether it was worth the money and how it compared to the Oneway 2436.

I currently have a Jet 1442 that I've had for a few years, and it works well, but I find myself limited by the lathe all to frequently (reeves, speed selection, weight, swing). I have access to a sawmill and therefore a ready supply of large timbers (I have 8 24" x 7" Pecan bowl blanks waxed in my basement, along with some hefty oak, not to mention a large hickory tree that is headed my way). I do mostly bowls and hollow vessels, but still do spindles as well from time to time.

I had considered building my own (I'm just that way sometimes), but I had pretty much decided to go with the Oneway a few months ago (I *just* missed one sold on craigslist by a jilted wife for $500 (five hundred!!!:eek:), but now that the Powermatic has come out, I'm having second thoughts. I've also considered the Stubby, Robust and Serious (and still do from time to time). I'm not in a hurry (yet), but I'm curious as to what everyone knows (or thinks) about the new one.
 
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Keith,
If I were you I would find a way to try the lathe you're going to buy. I found that I like cast iron and do not like steel so much. At one point I bought the Powermatic 3520b and told my wife that it was a stepping stone to the American Beauty. After using it the first day I told my wife that the 3520b would do everything I needed it to do. My club has a Oneway and I used one at a class at Craft Supplies and I just prefer Cast to steel. I am intrigued by the new 4224b and am seriously considering adding it to the stable. That is a personal thing so like I said try before you buy.
Bill
 
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For me, the sliding headstock alone is a major selling point. The new Powermatic is an excellent, versatile lathe - I saw it in San Jose and played with the controls a bit (...since there were no tires to kick!). I will be getting a Robust American Beauty as my next lathe purchase (and hopefully soon!), but the PM 4224B is the only other contender I would consider right now. I have turned on, and like the Oneway 2436 a lot (it is extremely well built), but I still consider the Robust AB perhaps the best lathe for my purposes that I can buy right now (....the so-called "last lathe you'll buy"). Eliminating the need to lean over the bed of a fixed headstock lathe is a HUGE improvement. The PM 4224 is very well thought out and well-built as well, but with a bit more versatility and ergonomic improvements - this would tip the scale for me in favor of the Powermatic over the Oneway.

Good luck with your decision!

Rob
 
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Eliminating the need to lean over the bed of a fixed headstock lathe is a HUGE improvement.

Why lean? Are the ways broader than the length of your handles, or are you making big hollows with no sidewinder handle?
 
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The biggest difference between steel and cast iron is the noises it makes. Reminds me of upgrading a hang glider years ago, and first flight in the new glider freaked me out because of the different noises it made in the air (frame, wires, etc.) After a few hours of air time, the noises were comforting because I got used to them. There are no rust problems with the steel ways, though I never had them with the PM 3520A I turned on for so many years. Just got used to the black ways.

I do prefer the sliding headstock. Your turning methods will vary with a long bed lathe as compared to a short bed lathe, and I learned with the headstock slid down to the end and standing off the end of the lathe to turn bowls and hollow forms. Much more comfortable to me. It drives me crazy to see some one use a sliding headstock or pivoting headstock lathe and not use that option. I prefer a push cut to a pull cut for finish cuts, and this is much easier with a short bed lathe so you don't have to extend your arms in the method that Stuart Batty uses.

I do like the new PM. Well thought out. However, given that the cost is very close to the American Beauty, I would choose it over the PM. I have thought about dampening the vibrations of the steel tube by injecting some of that expanding insulation foam, or maybe sand. Haven't done that yet though. Another advantage to the Beauty, I need speeds of 10 to 20 rpm for sanding my warped bowls. Brent helped me program the phase converter so it would do that. The 3520A used to do that, but when they switched to the B, they set low speed to 50 rpm. Way too fast for sanding warped bowls while they spin. They will not let you do it your self, but there is a thread here where it is explained. Also, if you need some help with some thing, you talk to Brent, rather than some technician who has to read a manual to find out what you are talking about.

robo hippy
 
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Thanks for the thoughts so far. I just found a demonstration scheduled this weekend of the 4224 with Nick Cook, so I'm going to try to make it there.

I do like the AB as well, but was concerned about steel vs cast iron. The sand idea was intriguing though. It's a good thing I'm not in a hurry to make up my mind.
 
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Keith

I suspect Nick will also be in the Powermatic booth at IWF. The show runs 22nd to 25th of this month at the Georgia World Congress Center downtown Atlanta. Many in the turning world can be seen at IWF either as demostrators, working thier non-turning day job or just visiting the show.

If you want to meet me and/or learn about laminating stop by Black Bros. at booth #5713.

Frank
 
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Robo,

Your last sentence there is probably the best selling point for the Robust or Oneway over a powermatic or any other lathe. And for those of us who have been stung by poor customer service, it really hits home!
 

john lucas

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Nick will also be demonstrating the lathe in Franklin, TN at theWoodcraft but I don't remember the date. I thought I wrote it down but apparently not. I looked over the lathe and really like it but then I've been very happy with my Powermatic 3520A. I would like to play with it more. Right now my 3520 does almost all I need and can be modified to do the few things It won't right now. However I want to keep my options open for the future and consequently will look at all the current more upscale models.
 

Bill Boehme

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Reed,

You mentioned a difference in sound. Later, you mentioned vibration. Are you referring to two different things? Just wondering because it seems to me that sound or noise can be heard, but not necessarily felt, and vice versa. Of course, sometimes it is both. You are probably turning much larger stuff than I turn. I have turned on a Powermatic 3520B and for the past year on my Robust AB and neither one vibrated when there was not a good reason (such as off balance chunk of wood) nor did the frame of either have an audible resonance.
 
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The only time my Robust vibrates is when I am coring out a bigger bowl. Mostly this is because it is almost impossible to attach the tailstock while coring. I learned on a 3520A, and most of the time didn't even have the tailstock on the lathe. The headstock spindle and the housing for it does extend out a bit farther on the Robust, and the Oneway (can't remember about the new big PM) by about 2 inches, than it did on my PM. This housing or whatever it is called, can be unbolted, so you can remove it to change bearings or the belt, some thing you could not do on the PM. I guess another part of that extra extension is for access to the bottom of the bowl when it is reversed, which to me is not needed as mine are finished turned before reversing. Some times I get a tiny bit vibration when I am getting really aggressive with my roughing cuts. This is when on the outside of a larger bowl.

To me, another buying point for the Robust is MADE IN THE USA.

robo hippy
 

hockenbery

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The Robust American beauty is one fine lathe.

ONEWAY, Robust, Stubby, powermatic, Vicmark.

Each might be best for you. Maybe the first decision is whether you like sliding stuff or not.
I prefer a fixed head stock but that is me.

I rarely want to use a short bed lathe. If I'd did I wold much prefer having a 17" bed on one side of the ONEWAY.

There are lots of folks who love sliding headstocks.
There are lots of folks who don't like sliding headstocks.
And both are right!
 
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I've found the sliding headstock on my current one to be useful, but as long as I can turn outboard safely I think I can work well either way. The way my shop is currently configured the sliding headstock would probably work better, but I suspect I'm going to have to reconfigure anyway. The good news is that moving from 14 to 24 or 25" will severly reduce the amount of outboard work i have to do.
 
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The Robust American beauty is one fine lathe.

ONEWAY, Robust, Stubby, powermatic, Vicmark.

Each might be best for you. ...

Allow me to add Serious (http://serioustoolworks.com/wood-lathes.php) to your list of top-of-the-line lathes worthy of consideration. Close to 1,600lbs of cast iron woodturning love!

Once I expand my shop (which won't be for a few more years), I'll make room for a new lathe from one of the makes listed above. It's nice to have so many worthy choices.
 
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I may get a look at the PM tonight, but does anyone know a place near north Atlanta I could try some of these others (AB, Oneway, Stubby, etc)?
 
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Perhaps try contacting the manufacturers, or the local clubs. Some of the companies are headed to Texas this weekend.

robo hippy
 
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well, I saw the 4224 in action yesterday. I have to say it's impressive (at least to me). Next step is a close up look at the AB, and I'm working on that as we speak. The Oneway seems to be fading a bit, because of the sliding headstocks on the other two. I definitely didn't leave with a bad impression of the yellow monster though.
 
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I see this thread was last posted to on the 17th, but thought I might interject my own thoughts. I spent a few months trying out some of the lathes mentioned above. Some manufacturers were quite helpful finding local users that would offer a little time on their equipment so I could actually do what I do on an actual sample of the equipment I was considering.

Get a hold of the manufacturers. If they're not willing to help you find a lathe to spend some time with, think long and hard about what the customer service be like IF you wind up needing assistance down the road.

I wound up with a Robust AB, the ergonomics were just too alluring. It just felt right. I didn't really know that until I had spent about 4 or 5 hours on one doing most of what I usually do on a lathe; and having some experience with the others to compare it to. Thanks again to a patient, accommodating owner and a manufacturer that was willing to take the time to seek him out for me.

My feeling - If you're going to part with the cash required to get one of these in your shop, make 'em earn it and make sure it works the way you do.

Just my two cents worth...
 
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demo

Thanks for the input. I'm working on a setting up a demo for the AB through Don Geiger. I attended a demonstration on the 4224 (with Nick Cook), but have yet to work with it. I agree though, this is going to come down to preference, I just don't know what the preference will be. I do know that I've really paid attention to the sliding headstock in my own shop since I asked this question. I think that's going to be a bigger factor than I had originally thought (hence the AB moving up in the list). I do appreciate everyone's advice. Any other thoughts are cetainly welcome. A big chunk of cash like this isn't going to be spent without a good bit of thought.

KB
 
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Keith: If the sliding headstock is the decider, you've got a problem - the new PowerMatic 4224 has a sliding headstock as does the Robust.

If I were you, I wouldn't settle for a little demo. I showed up with my chucks, tools and blanks (one balanced and tenon turned already and one just a half log section the way I usually prep them) and went from log to roughed out blanks, then got a bowl pretty close to finish turned before cleaning up. The owner I think got a bit of a chuckle as it became apparent that I might need to be forcefully removed from his shop.

I spent nearly an hour just cleaning up and bagging shavings - took them all with me when I left - and used the time to question him about what he liked and didn't like about his lathe.

Did the same thing for the OneWay (already had some time on the PowerMatic). Took some time, but I think I learned a lot about what I like and expect from a new piece of equipment.

After all, this thing cost is costing roughly 100 times what I paid for my first car. I needed to get it right the first time.
 
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Absolutely agree with trying them myself. The AB trial is already being set up, but the PM may take longer to arrange. I did get to talk at length with Nick Cook about the PM (and the first thing he told me was he was biased), and got a good bit of information from him. Useful, but not a trial with making shavings.

Btw, I know both of them have sliding headstocks. I was referring to the lack of one on the oneway, which is why it has dropped from the top of my list (but not off of it yet).
 
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I learned a lot of what I know on the 3520A, and my lathe sits in a corner, so that is why the Oneway and Serious were never on the list. I looked at the VB36, a fine piece of machinery, but it looked alien, kind of like the Stubby. Not anything wrong with any of them, but just not for me. I was thinking about a Nichols lathe when I got the PM for a lot less.

robo hippy
 
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I have the large outboard on my Oneway. I guess its what you are looking for. For me I have the room so just move from the inboard to the out board. Our club has a big Jet with a sliding headstock. It works. Some great turners have used it and Jimmy Clewes had only one complaint and that was the tool rest was to high. There are plenty of lathes with upgrades since I got my Oneway and I have not tried them out. But knock on wood i dont see me getting another lathe.
 
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