Help with first lathe...

Discussion in 'Newbie' started by David Tackett, Jul 29, 2013.

  1. Ian Thorn

    Ian Thorn

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    I have all nova chucks as do most of the turners from here and the clubs they are good chucks I have not seen the 1 refered to there advantage is all their jaws fit all the chucks so if you need a larger one later it's no problem.

    Ian
     
  2. Bill Boehme

    Bill Boehme Administrator Staff Member

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    I have heard, but I don't know for certain that particular model chuck has a more limited range of motion for its jaws than the other Nova chucks. For the other Nova chucks, I believe that the range of diameters for the jaws when turning bowels is about 3/4 inch from minimum diameter to maximum diameter. I see that it uses tommy bars rather than a "key" to tighten the jaws -- if you have three hands then that is not a problem, but otherwise I would go for the type that uses a key and makes it far easier to hold the work and tighten the chuck at the same time. And, what "features" would it be it packed with that almost all other chucks come with? :D
     
  3. MichaelMouse

    MichaelMouse

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    The Tommy Bar version is for practical purposes the original Nova chuck. I still have one, still use it for 20+ years. Use the tailstock as the third hand if you don't care to set and squeeze the bars to tighten, though that's a pretty simple thing to learn for a guy who's ever owned a router with two wrenches.

    The liability attorneys say no more than 12" and 680 rpm, and I believe them on half. No need for more than 680, but the way I turn, using the tailstock to keep the job between centers until the very end, 16" is not a problem with the chuck or the 50mm in a mortise. Definitely a nice thing to have, because it keeps you turning more than fiddling with other ways of mounting.

    A normal set of six tools contains five you will always use. Parting, roughing and 1/2" gouge, and a pair of skews. Last is normally a round-nosed scraper. Some use that, too. So get a set of something like the Benjamin's Best to learn with. Don't be one of those workmen who blames the tools and keeps grinding to a different contour every week. They'll go fast if you do. Learn enough to know that you might do better with a modified grind before you do it. Until then, use the tool as its own jig, laying it to the wheel or hone heel to toe and taking two light passes to brighten the metal.

    If you're going to go directly to bowls (nice spelling, Bill) get a "bowl" gouge of 3/8 to 1/2" flute and ~8" metal. Need not be a super alloy. This will be one tool you will have to regrind, as it will come probably straight across. Take it to your class and draw the "ears" back a bit. Use a few different types of grind at the class if available, and pick one to get yourself proficient enough to chose another grind to suit your style if needed.
     
  4. David Tackett

    David Tackett

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    Thanks for all the helpful information.
     
  5. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

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    David,
    you have had some good replies.,

    Most of the chucks on the market today have
    A key to tighten and loosen them
    Threaded inserts to fit popular lathes
    And sets of jaws.
    This Nova has the tommy bars and 1x8 threads re cut right into the chuck but all the Nova jaws will fit it.

    You can get this chuck reconditioned from novatoolsusa.com for $90.
    So I will go out on a limb and say it will be the best quality chuck you can find for $90
    The Nova folks have been really kind tour local turning clubs.

    I don't care for the jaw profile on this chuck. The jaws are basically straight with a little bead at the top.
    They just don't hold as well as other profiles. I have the original Nova which is very similar with 2 tommy bars.
    I Stopped using it with students because it was the only chuck anyone was having bowls come out of the chuck.

    For bowls, i prefer the ONEWAY serrated jaws or dovetail jaws.
    Professional Bowl turners are sort split close to 50-50 on ONEWAY chucks with serrated jaws and Vicmarc chucks with dovetail jaws

    It has been my experience that beginners have a slightly easier time with the ONEWAY jaws.
    Easy to make a 90 degree tenon a little under a 1/2" long.
    I prefer the dovetail grip because the tenon can be shorter and hold really well. Heck they will grip in a groove.
    The problem beginners have is not matching the dovetail profile and the get into problems.

    The ONEWAY Talon is a nice chuck for a small lathe. The small Vic mark is excellent too.
    The Talon comes with serrated jaws and later on you can add the dovetail jaws.

    For most end grain or spindle work, I prefer the ONEWAY jaws.
    The ONEWAY jaws are always my choice for holding square blanks and for holding any piece with 2 jaws.

    Have fun,
    Al
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  6. David Tackett

    David Tackett

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    Thanks for the additional info Al. The chuck part is really difficult for me, because I don't want to spend a 100 bucks and be disappointed or have the wrong chuck. Woodcraft currently has that Nova chuck on sale for $99, that is why I was inquiring about it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  7. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

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    David,
    You may get to work with some of the chucks at the woodcraft workshop.
    Also get some advice from the local club folks.

    Most serious turners end up owning several chucks.
    It's not an easy choice.
    Al
     
  8. David Tackett

    David Tackett

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    That's what I plan on doing. I'm not buying anything until I go to a class and talk with some turners face to face and actually use the tools. I am pretty certain of getting the Delta 46-460 though, the Jet 1221VS, might beat it out, but it is leading right now. I am just trying to obtain as much info as possible. I am a heavy duty researcher.

    David
     
  9. Bill Boehme

    Bill Boehme Administrator Staff Member

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    I was doing the southern phonetic spelling. :D

    My fingers have a reduced sense of proprioception and I depend a lot on the spell checker to ferret out most of the errors caused by hitting two adjacent keys.

    Actually, Al, the Talon comes with profiled jaws which are significantly different than serrated jaws. I think that most turners are not aware of the difference, but if you go to the Oneway site, you can find a description of the three different styles of jaws that they produce along with the advantages and disadvantages of each. Serrated jaws can easily mark tenons while profiled jaws are much kinder to the wood.

    BTW, the Talon is a very fine chuck. I like them so much that I have four of them and generally prefer them to my Stronghold except for very large heavy stuff that isn't quite big enough to make me decide that I ought to use a faceplate.

    MM, my spell checker caught nine spelling errors while typing this post. I'll leave it as an exercise to the reader to spot any others. :)
     
  10. MichaelMouse

    MichaelMouse

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    Darn nice price, if you're looking to save a few shekels. The old tenon vs mortise debate arises, as you note. The 50mm standard are not really tenon jaws, though then can do the job. They do the mortise well, as do the 25mm, though it would be nice if they included the 25mm pin jaws instead of the short ones. If you want a tenon instead of a mortise, you'll want the so-called 75mm jaws. Good inside dovetail to automatically wedge up against the shoulder of your tenon. http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2000403/10880/Nova-75mm-Bowl-Jaw-Set.aspx They're up over 20% since last year. Still, for the cost of the Oneway, you get three options.

    The Nova clone sold through PSI as "Barracuda" is pretty well regarded, giving good variety as well as quality for the money. http://www.amazon.com/PSI-CSC2000C-...id=1375350294&sr=8-2&keywords=barracuda+chuck
     
  11. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

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    Bill,
    You are correct. The profiled jaws are of course serrated but the profile giving each jaw 2 broad areas of contact gives the superior old.
    And traditional serrated jaws are just round on the inside.

    I like the Talon for small work and usually use it on small lathes. However I have been using the stronghold when I demo natural edge bowls on small lathes.
    The mass of the strong hold dampens some of the vibration allowing a slightly faster speed.

    ONEWAY also calls their dovetail jaws "smooth jaws" -:)

    The profile jaws are going to mark the tenon but not as badly as the sharp corners of other jaws.

    Al
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2013
  12. Dan Masshardt

    Dan Masshardt

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    I recently purchased the jet 1221vs and I'm pleased with it.

    One of the reasons I chose it over the Delta is the service issues Delta has been having.
     
  13. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

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    For what it is worth

    Jet/Powermatic company has been extremely supportive of AAW and woodturning in general. Whenever I contacted the folks at the company on behalf of AAW
    They would ask what can we do for AAW.

    I had 2 bad experiences with Delta on behalf of AAW when Delta backed out of commitments.
    Their attitude was what can AAW do for Delta....

    I will also mention that in addition to Jet/Powermatic, ONEWAY, Stubby, Robust, Vicmarc(woodworkers emporium), Technatool... Have all been extremely generous to AAW and our woodturning community. All of these companies and the men and women who run them are pleasant to deal with and very supportive of AAW.
    That same attitude carries over to supporting the people who buy their equipment.

    Al
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2013
  14. David Tackett

    David Tackett

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    Al,

    Does Powermatic make Jet products?

    David
     
  15. Mike Peace

    Mike Peace

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    Yes, Walter Meier is the parent company for Jet and Powematic.
     
  16. David Tackett

    David Tackett

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    Delta is losing ground fast after these last few comments. Anyone wanna help em out or watch em lose out to Jet.

    I see the 1221VS is $799 every where all the time. Does it ever go on sale?
     
  17. David Tackett

    David Tackett

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    I see what you mean now. I just found out if you buy a Jet 1221VS by Dec 31. 2013 you get a free year membership to AAW.


    http://blog.woodcraft.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/AAW-Membership.pdf
     
  18. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

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    David,

    Try Osolnik Machinery, berea, Kentucky.
    It is run by joe Osolnik.

    They carry Powermatics and some Jet machines. I have never heard of anyone beating his price on the powermatic lathes.

    Not sure if he has the jet VS1221 or not.

    Search on machinery osolnik to get his His web site then Call and ask.
    Web site is difficult to use.

    Al
     
  19. David Tackett

    David Tackett

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    Thanks for the tip. He is a real honest guy. He told me he wasn't cheap enough on small machines only the larger ones. He told me to go to Amazon.com.

    David
     
  20. Bill Boehme

    Bill Boehme Administrator Staff Member

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    Not quite. Jet, Powermatic, and Wilton along with others are part of Walter Meier Manufacturing Americas in in La Vergne, TN. The parent company, Walter Meier Holding Corporation is located in Auburn, WA. It appears that Powermatic and Jet are brand names of the WMH Tool Group and their woodworking machines are primarily made in Taiwan and elsewhere on the Pacific Rim.

    If you are interested here is a brief history of WMH. Also, Here is a chart showing the organizational structure. Jet does have a web site where they can display their woodworking wares. Here is a brief history of Jet and here is a brief history of Powermatic. And finally, here is a brief description of Jet's organization.
     

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