oneway #4 dovetails?

[Nick Boyd]

Want to get the largest dovetail jaws for my stronghold chucks - I think. So far I have found only #4 but they call them smooth - are oneways smooth jaws dovetails and if so, dovetails on inside AND outside

I feel that a #4 dovetail will be stronger/safer than a #5 serrated set - tell me if you think I am mistakin
Thank You
Update I have changed my mind

 

[Marshall Sadler]

Yes, Oneway calls their dovetail jaws smooth and yes, there is a dovetail on the inside and outside.

 

[Zach LaPerriere]

That's an interesting one. I have both, and prefer the serrated jaws. I turn softer woods, so perhaps that's why. I know most turners prefer the dovetails. I've heard that dovetail jaws are stronger, but I just haven't seen that in my experience. I do think there is a huge difference in how softer woods compress (and potentially break) than harder woods.

The only time I've had a tenon break was using too small of a tenon.

 

[Nick Boyd]

That's an interesting one. I have both, and prefer the serrated jaws. I turn softer woods, so perhaps that's why. I know most turners prefer the dovetails. I've heard that dovetail jaws are stronger, but I just haven't seen that in my experience. I do think there is a huge difference in how softer woods compress (and potentially break) than harder woods.

The only time I've had a tenon break was using too small of a tenon.

Understandable - Ive always felt like my serrated jaws are very good

 

[hockenbery]

I also think the serrated jaws hold better on a full tenon close to 1/2” in length with a flat spot next to the tenon to rest on the top of the closed jaws.

I’m more comfortable with dove tails on a short tenons say 1/8” in length or for gripping a groove.
The small tenons won’t survive a catch or rough use of the tools.

 

[robo hippy]

Well, I have always used dove tail jaws, and the smooth ones that come with my Vicmark chucks. As for hard vs softer woods, the biggest difference is hard woods want to crack when you catch, and soft woods will have more give, so to me, that comes down to how brittle the wood is. Well, if you never get catches....

The thing with the serrated jaws, you need extra depth for the serrated edges to cut into. I consider that extra depth to be a waste of wood. I seldom go more than 1/8 inch deep on my recess. Going deeper does not add to strength or holding ability unless you are turning an end grain spindle. You don't have to have the tenon bottom out in your chuck for it to weaken the grip. If the sides are not perfectly parallel to the chuck jaws, you get a leverage point.

The dove tail joint has been used in wood work forever and then some. It is a locking wedged joint, and holds far better than finger joints, which require glue or pins to hold.

robo hippy

 

[Marshall Sadler]

I did not know a deeper recess did not increase gripping strength, learn something new everyday. Although I am now armed with this knowledge I will probably continue to use a deep recess for coring and large bowls. (Assuming that a deep recess is somehow safer even if there is not a gain in grip strength)

 

[Fadi Zeidan]

Stewart Batty has an in-depth video on the jaw differences.

View: https://vimeo.com/68649130

 

[Nick Boyd]

I believe I have a grip on this issue now

As OP - Me believes largest diameter tenon/jaw possible given bowl size/shape where height of tenon is maximum but make sure not too tall so bowl does not meet and is not pressed against jaw edges, serrated jaws not dovetail - this assumes I am ok with ~1/2 inch tenon which means losing some finished bowl height. I have a #3 serrated jaw set for my strongholds which I don’t believe is quite large enough for what I am comfortable with for some of what I want to core/turn in some instances. I’ve come to believe serrated has a better hold as long as the tenon is 90 degrees and the tenon height is perfect; they don’t pull on the wood as part of their grip; just have to be responsible to keep the jaws cinched down tight - for either one. This assumes a blank which does not have mushyiness in the tenon area. I wish they made dovetails with serrations #4 and I would be perfectly happy. The overall answer really is - it all depends.....
Thanks all for the food for thought.