Tapermate? Really? Tell the truth now

Discussion in 'Newbie' started by Jamie Straw, Feb 10, 2016.

  1. John K Jordan

    John K Jordan

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    I thought about the knock-out bar issue as I was extracting the mandrel after "seating" it with the mallet. The end of the taper is drilled and threaded for a drawbar. Seems like it might not take much abuse to make a drawbar unusable. A solution could be to put a steel bolt into the hole to protect it from the knock-out bar. I personally don't plan to use a drawbar on these. (I do use one on a Jacobs chuck when holding tiny things for turning.)

    Now that you mentioned it, I have never seen an aluminum taper before now. All that I have are steel, some hardened. Beall does it right with their buffing mandrels. The mandrels are aluminum but the MT is steel, held in the mandrel with a couple of set screws.

    The Rubber Chucky mandrels must work ok in general. Rudy Lopez, demonstrator at the TAW this year, has used them extensively (his recommendation and demo was the reason I bought some). I hope to get with Rudy sometime later this year - I'll ask him how his have held up.

    I'm sure we've all see even steel tapers that were scarred, galled, and badly scratched. I've seen spur drive centers deformed badly where someone has probably hammered the wood into the spur while the center is in the headstock spindle. (Never do that!! At minimum, not good for the bearings.) Fortunately, an abused drive center seems less of a potential problem than a long mandrel, since even if the center is sloppy the error would be small since the working distance is very short.

    When I have a choice, I always buy precision ground hardened steel tapers, especially for adapters (to minimize compounding errors). I have a bunch of MT2 and MT1 taper drills and I know some of them are hardened. (BTW, if someone doesn't know about taper drill bits they are a dream on a lathe, both for accuracy and for limited bed length mini lathes, since no Jacobs chuck is needed.)

    As for the bad aluminum tapers, I can fix them, either by re-machining the taper or by cutting a relief in the center then carefully filing the outer ring while turning. (I always relieve the center of tapers I cut in wood so I can use the headstock spindle as a jam chuck - this forgives a lot in wood.) If I find some time (ha!) I may even machine new mandrels from steel - the threads would be easy to cut and a taper is not that hard to get right since I have a calculator. :)

    JKJ
     
  2. hu lowery

    hu lowery

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    depends on how you operate . . .



    John,

    The makers of toys do need those who like to fill their shops with them. I bought my share when I was young. Most of them hung on the wall until somebody came along and I gave them away.

    I did turn a dedicated tapered dowel for cleaning the tapers in my spindles. Used it today for the first time in I don't know when. It was the first thing handy when I needed a live center extension to put pressure in the bottom of a deep bowl while mounting it in a chuck. Guess I should have drug out the catalogs, I'm sure somebody makes a live center extension I could have bought instead of using a low tech piece of wood I had laying around.

    Hu
     
  3. John K Jordan

    John K Jordan

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    I don't know of a very long extension, although there are some precision MT2-MT2 adapters that would extend the live center maybe 5" extra inches. I'd probably do the wood thing you mentioned.

    But I'm curious, how do you proceed to turn a deep bowl such that it needs inside support from the tailstock - do you turn the inside first? I almost always turn the outside of things first then reverse, chuck, and turn the inside. Or do you mean you use this to finish turn rough-turned bowls?

    As for toys... Yes, my shop, farm, barn, equipment and storage buildings, and house are full of toys - wood lathes, flat wood shop, milling machine/metal lathe toys, welding shop, plasma cutter, sharpening machines, electronics bench, photography studio, hydraulic toys, vehicle maintenance toys, tractor with attachable toys, bobcat, backhoe, sawmill, horses, trailers, diesel mowers, firing range playground, cave-diving scuba gear, pianos, synthesizers, guitars, horns, video editing studio, lasers, telescopes, microscopes, Kindles, computer toys,... Difference might be I use these toys (except I've quit the cave diving).

    Every day is play day!

    JKJ
     
  4. Jim Chrisawn

    Jim Chrisawn

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    Simple solution

    I turn my own out of a soft wood and slightly long and this allows me to wrap with a thin cloth or paper towel, add a bit of denatured alcohol and clean as needed. It has worked for the past 20 plus years, cheap, and simple.
     
  5. Jamie Straw

    Jamie Straw

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    Sensible! Also sounds like micro-practice for the French rolling pin I want to turn.;);) Thanks.
     
  6. Douglas Ladendorf

    Douglas Ladendorf

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    This thread has me thinking of making something close enough to the taper for cleaning. I use my dry finger before inserting anything, and occasionally WD-40 on a paper towel for cleaning and some rust prevention. Interesting thoughts above, and JKJ you are lucky that's an easy fix for you. I'm with Odie though. It would go right back.

    Doug
     
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  7. John K Jordan

    John K Jordan

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    Oh, I love making those! And twice so far I've had kids, both 10 years old, "make" them as Christmas presents for their mothers. The kids got to pick out the wood, measure, mark, try holding a roughing gouge, sand a bit, and rub on oil. They were both so proud of themselves!

    jaden_img_1254.jpg
    Jaden makes a present.

    rolling_pins_five.jpg
    The bottom one in this picture is Dogwood, my favorite for rolling pins. Hard to find though. Just today I cut a bunch of dogwood blanks sized for future rolling pins, probably after at least 5 years of air drying!

    JKJ
     
  8. John K Jordan

    John K Jordan

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    I actually made the call with the intent of sending them back for a quick replacement. Bad batch, sorry, end of discussion.

    That was right up to the point where the guy said yes, send them back but I would get the same thing sent back to me since they were all exactly the same (and all perfectly machined, of course.) At that point I just gave up and told him thanks, but I would just fix them myself. I decided that arguing the point would have been like trying to reason with one of those pre-recorded telephone messages. I have more productive things to do.

    JKJ
     
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  9. Douglas Ladendorf

    Douglas Ladendorf

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    Well sure, it's CNC. How could it POSSIBLY be anything less than perfect?!

    Sigh...
     
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  10. Douglas Ladendorf

    Douglas Ladendorf

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    That Dogwood looks a lot like some Beech I have set aside for rolling pins.
     
  11. John K Jordan

    John K Jordan

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    I am often surprised by what I find in dogwood. Often the wood is a creamy white, sometimes with a pinkish cast, the heart is dark brown, and occasionally there is striking color. One log I cut yesterday had some striking red, orange, and brown in some areas. The crotch flame is spectacular.

    Dogwood is one of my favorites for turning - it is heavy, hard, strong, very fine-grained, and often needs little or no sanding. It also machines beautifully on the milling machine. Traditionally used for things that got a lot of handling like shuttles for looms, it is supposed to get smoother with handling. Warps like crazy! It's almost impossible to buy commercially - most of what I'm using now is from downed trees on my farm and has been air-drying for almost 10 years. Since many people have never even tried it, I've passed out pieces at club meetings and often stick a piece or two in the box if I'm shipping something to another woodturner.

    I use it for finials, boxes, small bowls, goblets, magic wands, finger tops, pens, conductor's batons, tool handles, pepper grinders, rolling pins, billy clubs, dibbles, ornaments, spinning wheel parts, kitchen gadgets, knobs, shop jigs, push sticks, and firewood!

    http://www.wood-database.com/lumber-identification/hardwoods/dogwood/

    JKJ
     
  12. Tom Albrecht

    Tom Albrecht

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    What is a "tapermate" and where does one get it?
     
  13. Clifton C

    Clifton C

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  14. Tom Albrecht

    Tom Albrecht

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    Oh heck, I have one of those and use it frequently, but I've had it a long time and I know I didn't pay anywhere near 20 bucks for it.
    Thanks.
    As a matter of fact, I have a #3 that I can't use anymore if anyone is interested.
     
  15. john lucas

    john lucas

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    Ditto Odie. I do have a metal lathe but my skills aren't up to turning a really accurate morse taper. On the use of aluminum I know that Bestwoodtools does make aluminum parts but adds steel morse tapers to those parts. I agree I don't think an aluminum morse taper would handle forces very long before galling.
    When installing a morse taper into a drill press the first time you might need to use a mallet or at least put a lot of pressure on it. After that you should never have to touch it. On wood lathes nothing more than a hard push should do the job.
     
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  16. Michael Mills

    Michael Mills

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    I just use a small nylon bottle brush with a small amount of wd40 to clean. Before using I wrap a popsicle stick in a little bit of paper towel to remove any excess oil.

    In the "an ounce of prevention is worth....:
    Lightly insert a fishing cork in the MT, it does not interfere with my chucks or faceplates. On the handwheel side a cork form a wine bottle fits fine and easy to pull out. Again, the operative word is lightly.
     
  17. Tom Hamilton

    Tom Hamilton

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    I have one and use it all the time, primarily on my midi lathe because it's got a swiveling head.

    After I've found a hole I drilled on the lathe a little off center for calls or pens I find the headstock needs just a little alignment adjustment.

    I check the alignment between the tailstock and headstock a couple times a week with a steel double ended MT2 alignment tool, but before I use that tool I clean both tapers with the tapermate.

    I use it on my big lathe too, but primarily only during maintenance.

    Happy turning - Tom
     
  18. odie

    odie

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    Using corks to plug the MT access is a good method of keeping dust and debris out. These days, I always remove my tailstock when not in use, but I did use corks when I left it on the lathe.....:D

    -----odie-----
     
  19. Jamie Straw

    Jamie Straw

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    I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing here, Tom. The "Tapermate" is a green, spiral-shaped polyurethane "stick" that sold to clean out the taper on a lathe. See this page. Are you referring to the double-ended tapers that are used to align headstock and tailstock?
     
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  20. john lucas

    john lucas

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    Jamie is correct. The tapermate is for cleaning a morse taper. The double end morse taper is for aligning the headstock and tailstock.
     
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