• We just finished moving the forums to a new hosting server. It looks like everything is functioning correctly but if you find a problem please report it in the Forum Technical Support Forum (click here) or email us at forum_moderator AT aawforum.org. Thanks!
  • Beware of Counterfeit Woodturning Tools (click here for details)
  • Johnathan Silwones is starting a new AAW chapter, Southern Alleghenies Woodturners, in Johnstown, PA. (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Peter Jacobson for "Red Winged Burl Bowl" being selected as Turning of the Week for April 29, 2024 (click here for details)
  • Welcome new registering member. Your username must be your real First and Last name (for example: John Doe). "Screen names" and "handles" are not allowed and your registration will be deleted if you don't use your real name. Also, do not use all caps nor all lower case.

What lathe should I buy?

Joined
Sep 9, 2020
Messages
176
Likes
1,308
Location
Portland, Oregon
I’ve got a version of this lathe in the UK. I know it was sold in Canada in a fetching Green colour. Not sure if you can get them your side of the border though. They’re all made in Taiwan. It’s a very capable small lathe with a 14” bowl capacity. I bought the optional 10” bed extension.

Looks like this one available in the US:
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2024
Messages
256
Likes
139
Location
Bournemouth, UK
Yes, that’s the one Kevin. They make a couple of bed extensions for it, or at least they did. A large one and a 10” one. With the 10” version it’s proven to be the perfect size lathe for me.
They sell a very slightly different Black version in Germany which is nice if you live in mainland Europe.

 
Joined
Jul 19, 2017
Messages
431
Likes
345
Location
Roscoe, Illinois
I can't recommend any Laguna lathe based on their customer service and build quality. My 12/16 has been fine for my needs, the lathe checked most of the boxes for features I was looking for, but in my opinion it's just not reliable. I'm seriously think about selling it and getting another lathe.
Just curious, if your Laguna lathe meets your needs, what isn't reliable about it. I know someone who seems to be ready to buy one and it would be nice to know what problems you've had with your Laguna.
 
Joined
Dec 28, 2019
Messages
456
Likes
480
Location
Tallahassee, FL
Just curious, if your Laguna lathe meets your needs, what isn't reliable about it. I know someone who seems to be ready to buy one and it would be nice to know what problems you've had with your Laguna.
Oh man, where do I start. It's a pretty lathe (the 12/16), their lathes have most of the features I need or want, and because it's a US based company I really wanted to recommend them but I can't.
If you search this forum you'll see posting from me about my issues but in short I've had machinal issues and more importantly issues with their customer service. On the machinal side I've had forward/reverse switch go out on me. It's an easy fix (once you know how) but since I've owned my lathe for four years now it's not under warranty and I had to order the part and wait for it. I'm now the owner of 2 switches, one in the unit and a extra in case it goes out. And my experience is not a limited one, doing research about this issue I've found many people with bad switches, one poor guy who had to replace his switch 6 times in a few years. I discovered that the threading on the spindle for outboard turning in the headstock was badly machined so I had to fix that. The aluminum faceplate that holds down the switches and controls is not very well made and is falling apart, I noticed the screws working themselves out of their housing about 2 years ago and had to tighten them. I've had issues with the floating bearing and thought I've fixed it but realized this week that no I didn't fix it and I need to do that. Also, the 1 HP motor bogs down with larger pieces. Really anything over 6" but it's really noticeable with blanks 8" and larger. IMO, that motor isn't made to turn blanks larger than 6". And I don't think the readout for the variable speed controller is correct. I was hoping this lathe would last me and my son 20 years now I'm hoping it last until my FiL decides to past down his lathe. The 12/16 doesn't come with a stand so by the time you buy the lathe, stand and casters you're hitting the $1500 mark. If you decide to extend the bed or turn outboard add another $500 to that total. For that price or a little more you can, imo, get a better built lathe with more options.
On the customer service side I've had issues with orders, with parts being out of stock, with delivery dates, with CS reps leaving Laguna so you have to start over with your inquiry, and with their online store. I get the feeling that they don't really want to run their own store or deal directly with customers but do it, I guess as a service to their customers. I suspect they rather be a wholesaler only.
Want to know anything else? :)
 
Joined
Jul 19, 2017
Messages
431
Likes
345
Location
Roscoe, Illinois
Oh man, where do I start. It's a pretty lathe (the 12/16), their lathes have most of the features I need or want, and because it's a US based company I really wanted to recommend them but I can't.
If you search this forum you'll see posting from me about my issues but in short I've had machinal issues and more importantly issues with their customer service. On the machinal side I've had forward/reverse switch go out on me. It's an easy fix (once you know how) but since I've owned my lathe for four years now it's not under warranty and I had to order the part and wait for it. I'm now the owner of 2 switches, one in the unit and a extra in case it goes out. And my experience is not a limited one, doing research about this issue I've found many people with bad switches, one poor guy who had to replace his switch 6 times in a few years. I discovered that the threading on the spindle for outboard turning in the headstock was badly machined so I had to fix that. The aluminum faceplate that holds down the switches and controls is not very well made and is falling apart, I noticed the screws working themselves out of their housing about 2 years ago and had to tighten them. I've had issues with the floating bearing and thought I've fixed it but realized this week that no I didn't fix it and I need to do that. Also, the 1 HP motor bogs down with larger pieces. Really anything over 6" but it's really noticeable with blanks 8" and larger. IMO, that motor isn't made to turn blanks larger than 6". And I don't think the readout for the variable speed controller is correct. I was hoping this lathe would last me and my son 20 years now I'm hoping it last until my FiL decides to past down his lathe. The 12/16 doesn't come with a stand so by the time you buy the lathe, stand and casters you're hitting the $1500 mark. If you decide to extend the bed or turn outboard add another $500 to that total. For that price or a little more you can, imo, get a better built lathe with more options.
On the customer service side I've had issues with orders, with parts being out of stock, with delivery dates, with CS reps leaving Laguna so you have to start over with your inquiry, and with their online store. I get the feeling that they don't really want to run their own store or deal directly with customers but do it, I guess as a service to their customers. I suspect they rather be a wholesaler only.
Want to know anything else? :)
That's too bad. These machines are too expensive to have those kinds of problems.
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2024
Messages
256
Likes
139
Location
Bournemouth, UK
I’m always a bit dubious about proprietary speed controls etc. The lathe that I have, mentioned earlier, has a three phase motor and an off the shelf inverter. This setup seems to be quite robust. I’m also not a fan of membrane switches. I’ve had equipment fail before with these things. I much prefer mechanical switches as they are easily replaced if the contacts go on them.
 
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
Messages
68
Likes
42
Location
Reidsville, NC
Robert,

You've gotten a lot of good advice here, Mr. Coers in particular. I just went through this process a short while back; lots of interest in the endeavor, not much turning experience to speak of, and not a lot of knowledge about machines other than reading a ton of internet posts with two tons of opinions and the unavoidable marketing literature. I'll try to share what my own considerations and decisions were, and I may repeat some others' advice, but I have some additional details you might want to consider.

Regarding the rotating headstock vs sliding. You won't really save a ton of floor space with a rotating headstock (HS), since you'll simply find yourself standing a bit further over on the HS end when you rotate it. Just trading room on the left for room on the right. It will save some room, though, possibly up to 100% if you don't rotate 90 degrees or only stand directly in front (unlikely). The biggest advantage is going to be ergonomics, and if you have plenty of space in your shop (and depending on which machine you buy) standing at the tail end of a sliding lathe should only be marginally less ergonomic than rotating a HS, if at all. There is an ergonomic cost to sliding the HS as well, but again, this is trivial. Tedium is the bigger risk there, also trivial. In the end, I chose rotating mostly because I *do* have terribly limited space, and the lathe I wanted for other reasons had a rotating HS anyway.

Like any hobby that requires equipment, or anything else in life, I would always recommend getting the highest quality you can get. Pay until it hurts. Too many beginners get cheap crap to get started, but instead of eventually upgrading, they get discouraged with poor results, have zero fun, blame themselves, and quit. Sure, a skilled craftsman can compensate [somewhat] for poor tools, but this doesn't apply to beginners. As I used to always hear over on my car forum: "buy once, cry once". In the long run, you will save money buying better tools, but much more importantly, you will be free to focus on your growing skill, not overcoming limitations of junk equipment, and you'll enjoy the entire experience so much more. This does not apply to your first set of chisels, which can be of average quality and price since you will grind them down quickly while you learn to sharpen -- BUT, do get steel that will at the very least hold an edge.

Speaking of upgrades, one thing that people did not mention is spindle size. You're shopping right in the area where the lathes use 1" and 1.25" spindles. Everything mounted on the spindle (chucks, etc.) will be sized accordingly. So, if you buy a 12" lathe and decide you just need a bit more swing (or a bit higher quality), then you have to buy all new stuff for the 1.25" spindle. That can get expensive. I bought my lathe that has a 1.25" spindle for this reason. As many suggest, try to go large, but you don't need a 24" swing, based on what you've stated. A 14" to 18" lathe is your field. Most banjos are about 2" above the bed, so a 14" swing equates to a 10" diameter piece without too much hassle. Also keep in mind that you will be needing extra room for rough blanks before you get them into round. So, that 18" lathe really is not too big for what you are considering. Price goes up significantly after 16" though.

As alluded to above, consider your shop size. Don't just set aside room for the lathe, but you also need 4 feet of clearance in front of it, and if turning off the end, add it there too. Also, you'll need a bench or stand for your grinder, and the same clearance. You might get away with three feet around the lathe, but that's pretty tight and I wouldn't consider that safe for my own use. You also don't want to back up away from the lathe and keep bruising your a** on the corner of your workbench constantly.

The mass of the machine matters. You ideally want your mass to be concentrated right in the center of rotation around the spindle. Sine that's not really possible, you want to be as close as possible. Get a heavy machine. It helps with *every* piece, not just the big wobblies. Lots of people add weight to their stands, and that's great for keeping the machine from walking around the shop with a wobbly, but it doesn't really mitigate vibration like having a 16-ton lathe bed would. I exaggerate to make the point. A longer bed will also vibrate more, all other things being equal. You want ROCK SOLID, which also implies sturdy construction. Take a look at pictures of a Robust, Vicmarc, or a Oneway lathe (with the cool whale spine) and then compare to the sheet metal construction of a HF lathe. Mass = expense, but it's probably one of the top five attributes affecting performance.

Sticking with machine attributes a bit longer, we get to power. This one is simple. 210v > 110v. 2hp > 1hp. Variable speed is an absolute necessity. There are multiple kinds of variable-speed drives, with multiple controllers. That's a whole 12 conversations by itself, but there is a hierarchy in terms of quality. As always, higher quality costs more. You will do fine with the best two or three types. There is discussion and some disagreement about the newer servo motors. Personally, I love mine, but don't have a frame of reference, so I will not make a suggestion. Maybe I bought into marketing hype, or maybe it's actually better. I am not taking a position, because I don't have expertise here. Do a bit more research, pick out your top two or three for performance reasons, then get the best one you can afford. Naturally, these things don't come a la carte, but it should be a line item on your pros/cons list.

Now, precision. Most modern machines come with bearings made in Taiwan (that's a good thing). The casting and machining of the HS also affects precision. Also with bearings, there are machines with two bearings, and some with three. Debate follows this too. My reading was that machines with two bearings make their owners very happy. Machines with three bearings make their owners happy. My personal opinion is that the machines with three bearings are likely slightly more precise -- perhaps/probably imperceptibly for woodwork -- but more importantly, they will last longer in theory. That being said, plenty of two-bearing owners have stated their bearings have run solidly for two, three decades. I considered it a very-nice-to-have but not a dealbreaker. If I planned on doing production work, I might care more about longevity. In addition to the bearings, your precision is affected by the tolerances of the HS, TS, and bed. It's not a CNC machine, but if your spindles don't align decently, you'll have some difficulty achieving those astonishing results.

Noise level. Nobody talks about this one much, but it was and is extremely important to me. I hate, hate, hate loud noise. A servo motor is whisper quiet. Literally. There is no cooling fan. I can hear someone whisper from ten feet away while a spindle turns at 1500 rpm on my lathe. It was so important, I sacrificed swing for it (and for the larger spindle). It's bad enough that I have to figure out how to put my dust collector in a remote area, but at least I can do that. I can't put the lathe on the other side of the wall. The only noise I hear when I turn is the chisel against the wood. This is one thing where you really do need to be in the same room with the lathe to assess, which I know is difficult. This adds a great deal of Zen for me. Ask Odie what that means...

If you haven't figured it out by now, I chose the T40. Most people shy away from it because it is a few hundred more than a comparable lathe, and they made the unfortunate decision to make it a 14" lathe, although that's probably the practical limit of the motor. This lathe, like any other, is not for everyone. The upsides are: it has a decent swing (I would much prefer 18", would settle for 16", and really kinda hated being forces to go with 14). It has the 1.25" spindle. Three bearings. Rotating HS. Precision. One of the heaviest midi lathes out there with nice thick castings. It is SO quiet. Higher build quality in general, in terms of switches, controller, etc. The downsides are: it has that 14" swing. Note that I left the price out of this list. Is it more expensive than a lot of 12" lathes, or even some cheaper 16" lathes? Sure. But not when you compare apples to apples. Start with the spindle, and go from there. You might find it to be one of the best values out there. Yes, I am offering a recommendation, but I'm not on the take. I put a lot of research into the decision, and it's a pretty impressive machine for the money. But sure, you can get a 12" lathe for $1,000, maybe even less. If you never upgrade, you did well. If you do want a bigger lathe, you're pretty much starting over with the lathe and accessories that are mounted on the spindle(s). To my mind, that savings right there justified the "extra" cost the T40. Of course this is my lifer lathe, but two years ago, before I moved, I was in my forever house.

Generally speaking, as so many have said in so various ways, if you want a quick rule of thumb: stay away from Grizzly unless you can find one of their older ones that doesn't suck (and usually are not for sale). Stay away from no-names. Stay far, FAR away from HF, Sears, and Shopsmith (jack of all trades, absolutely sucks at everything). Approach Laguna with caution. Be open to Jet, Harvey, Powermatic, Record Power, Nova and their ilk. You will find that they are all priced according to the you-get-what-you-pay-for rule, although Powermatic is by far the most expensive in the group, kinda wants to be in the top tier. If you're loaded, you've already bought a Vic, Robust, or Oneway, and you're definitely getting what you paid for. Actually, that goes for the cheap ones too, except you'll get even less than you paid for. Many people think they have their lifer lathe, but consider resale value anyway. Mid-level and higher lathes all hold their value. I would not touch a used low-end lathe, simply becasue if it was junk in the first place there's a good chance it was treated like junk all its life too.

Now, there's one thing I see all the time that I disagree with. The certain advice that says "you pay as much for accessories as you pay for the lathe". That's nonsense. A startup kit is a fairly fixed amount. In the beginning, it might be the same and probably will be (thus the rule), or maybe more if you get a really cheap/small lathe, or maybe less than what you spend on the lathe if you get a nice one (for that size). By the end of a lifelong addiction, you'll spend vastly more on stuff than on lathes, from what I understand. To start out, you're looking at about $1,000 to $1,400 for that stuff to get started, no matter what lathe you buy. Yup. You need chisels (I would say $200 there, but can start with as little as $80 with the classic Benjamin's Best set), a low-speed grinder (don't skimp here either, a grinder also needs to run true, and the very popular 2hp Rikon is a good value and comes with two wheels to get you started, but budget for replacing those in the near future) at $200-$300, some grinding jig stuff, maybe $150 there, dust control for at least $200 and another hundred or two for pipe/hose, a nice chuck at $250 and some more dollars soon to buy a couple more jaw sets, then $300 or so on piddles like calipers, a bit more PPE that you don't yet have, the inevitable minor workshop build-out for storage and perhaps a bench for the lathe and one for the grinder. If you don't have a chainsaw, add a few hundred more for that. Maybe that's not Day 1, but it's Day Soon. The point is, if you buy a Robust, you don't also have to drop another $8K on some beginning chisels and a grinder.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2021
Messages
1,029
Likes
1,405
Location
Parkersburg, West Virginia
The main reasons for me buying the Record Power were at the time nobody had all of the features I wanted at the time. I wanted the pivoting headstock because of spine problems. If I can stand up straight in front of the piece I can turn longer. I also wanted the pivoting headstock for the ability to turn larger pieces if I wanted. I also wanted a remote pendant with all of the controls. It just seems unsafe to me to have to reach around a large, fast spinning chunk of wood to change speeds and turn it off. I bought my lathe before I saw this video but was glad My lathe has the pendant after I saw it. If you don’t want to watch the whole thing then skip to the 4 minute mark.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCK2v-JF13k
 

hockenbery

Forum MVP
Beta Tester
TOTW Team
Joined
Apr 27, 2004
Messages
8,642
Likes
4,986
Location
Lakeland, Florida
Website
www.hockenberywoodturning.com
I bought my lathe before I saw this video but was glad My lathe has the pendant after I saw it. If you don’t want to watch the whole thing then skip to the 4 minute mark.

I assume your interest in this guy is for a do not do this safety lesson for your club.

Not sure how he missed these cracks.
Plus just in case the cracks might hold together he puts more stress on them with a recess.

IMG_0982.jpeg

This guy needs some mentoring. He’s an accident waiting to happen.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 14, 2007
Messages
5,493
Likes
2,843
Location
Eugene, OR
Ummm, YUP! Part of the reason I never turn anything that already has cracks in it. As for the recess it may or may not have added to the problem. If you over tighten, then it can be a problem, and if combined with a catch and too high rpms, then for sure it will happen. I don't think a tenon would have helped.

robo hippy
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2021
Messages
1,029
Likes
1,405
Location
Parkersburg, West Virginia
I assume your interest in this guy is for a do not do this safety lesson for your club.

Not sure how he missed these cracks.
Plus just in case the cracks might hold together he puts more stress on them with a recess.

View attachment 59622

This guy needs some mentoring. He’s an accident waiting to happen.
I already used him for a safety lesson at our club. We have a handful of new turners that I thought needed to see this.
 
Joined
Sep 19, 2023
Messages
398
Likes
610
Location
Columbia, TN
I just ordered the Rikon 1824VSR, the 110v version ($2699, free shipping from Acme). So far, I really like my Rikon equipment. Hopefully this lathe doesn't disappoint. It's 1.75 HP, which is possibly the highest HP you can get for 110.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2021
Messages
1,029
Likes
1,405
Location
Parkersburg, West Virginia
I just ordered the Rikon 1824VSR, the 110v version ($2699, free shipping from Acme). So far, I really like my Rikon equipment. Hopefully this lathe doesn't disappoint. It's 1.75 HP, which is possibly the highest HP you can get for 110.
You can get 2 and 3hp 120 volt motors you just need to run the correct wiring to them.
 
Joined
Dec 16, 2022
Messages
112
Likes
173
Location
Mesa, AZ
Good to know. I'm not in the market for a new lathe of any kind, but nice to know the capability of things, cause ya never know when you'll need to know...

I seem to recall that when Jet upgraded the 1642 (to the 1640 I think it is), it had a pivoting headstock (I think it maybe slid too? not sure - that would be weird). But I remember being at Woodcraft for our club meeting when it came out, and several of us were quite unimpressed with the slop in the headstock alignment. And it wasn't long before Jet redid it and now it just slides. That 5-minute look tainted my impression of pivoting headstocks. Ya'll are sorta helping me get over that, although I still like my slider.
I actually have that exact model of 1640 that both pivots and slides. The slop is there and a problem if the capture nut wasn't properly set initially. I have two dead centers I use to align the head and tail after rotating the headstock and it takes a few seconds to get them aligned, but then it's not even an afterthought.
 
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
Messages
68
Likes
42
Location
Reidsville, NC
I actually have that exact model of 1640 that both pivots and slides. The slop is there and a problem if the capture nut wasn't properly set initially. I have two dead centers I use to align the head and tail after rotating the headstock and it takes a few seconds to get them aligned, but then it's not even an afterthought.
There is an M2-M2 alignment tool out there in the $20 USD range. Not affiliated, etc. (Nova also offers one, for example). Literally takes seconds to get it dialed in. What happens when you try to lock it down is beyond the scope of the tool. :rolleyes:

One example:
https://www.amazon.com/Lathe-Test-Buddy-Bar-Harden/dp/B07PH5CB3X/ref=sr_1_5?crid=15S1WLX4LKWND&keywords=2MT+-+2MT&qid=1706096437&s=hi&sprefix=2mt+-+2mt,tools,230&sr=1-5
 
Joined
Apr 20, 2006
Messages
1,273
Likes
1,004
Location
Erie, PA
One alignment tool came with my new Neptune lathe. So far it hasn't been needed as the detents work well.
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2024
Messages
256
Likes
139
Location
Bournemouth, UK
I can’t remember which professional turner it was but he said he didn’t like swivel head lathes. I must admit that having had one myself at one point I don’t either. My own personal opinion is a head that just slides like the big Powermatic is a much better idea. If you have a bench mounted lathe then I guess a swivel head could be useful though.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2021
Messages
1,029
Likes
1,405
Location
Parkersburg, West Virginia
There is an M2-M2 alignment tool out there in the $20 USD range. Not affiliated, etc. (Nova also offers one, for example). Literally takes seconds to get it dialed in. What happens when you try to lock it down is beyond the scope of the tool. :rolleyes:

One example:
https://www.amazon.com/Lathe-Test-Buddy-Bar-Harden/dp/B07PH5CB3X/ref=sr_1_5?crid=15S1WLX4LKWND&keywords=2MT+-+2MT&qid=1706096437&s=hi&sprefix=2mt+-+2mt,tools,230&sr=1-5
I just line up the points on the drive center and live center. Very fast and easy.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2021
Messages
1,029
Likes
1,405
Location
Parkersburg, West Virginia
I can’t remember which professional turner it was but he said he didn’t like swivel head lathes. I must admit that having had one myself at one point I don’t either. My own personal opinion is a head that just slides like the big Powermatic is a much better idea. If you have a bench mounted lathe then I guess a swivel head could be useful though.
Just curious what you didn’t like about the pivoting head? Mine will pivot and slide. I don’t like to slide it because it takes longer and I have to remove the tail stock. Every bowl or hollow form I turn I have to be able to stand in front of it because of spine problems. To me pivoting the head is much easier for me.
IMG_0363.jpeg
 
Joined
Jan 10, 2024
Messages
256
Likes
139
Location
Bournemouth, UK
What I didn’t like was the tool post support. On my old lathe it was much further from the bed than with the head in its normal in-line position. Some lathes are particularly bad in this respect.
 
Joined
Aug 14, 2007
Messages
5,493
Likes
2,843
Location
Eugene, OR
Stuart Batty is a big opponent of sliding and pivoting headstocks, and prefers the fixed headstock. As far as I am concerned, if done properly, they work the same. If done poorly, which just about all the first variations of these did, there are vibration issues. The pressure plate on the bottom of the headstock needs to be about the size of the headstock tower, or a little less, and not the same one that is used on the tailstock or banjo. On my Vicmark 240, there is a set screw lever thing which when screwed in, makes vibration a non issue.

robo hippy
 
Back
Top