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Thread: Ellsworth grind with Tormek

  1. #1
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    Default Ellsworth grind with Tormek

    In the July 2005 issue of More Woodturning Mr. Holder explained how to sharpen a 5/8" rod bowl gouge on the Tormek. The information came from Torgny Jansson who works for Tormek. It requires the protrusion of the tool be three inches from the SVD-!85 jig. A wooden spacer 2.05" is used to set the space between the wheel and the universal support. The jig itsself dosen't have a marking for anything higher than 5 but the jig is set to what would be 6. I don't own a Ellsworth gouge so can't say how this works but Mr. Holder says it makes the grind he was looking for.

    Ron

  2. #2
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    I used my CAD program to essentially arrive at about the same results. The spacer block size will vary depending on your exact individual set-up unless you want to grind away a lot of extra metal. The jig setting also will vary, depending on how long you want the wings. The bottom line is that even after calculating all of the settings, that is just a starting point anyway and it will take some tweaking to match the bevel across the whole cutting edge. I still run into a hard stop that prevents sharpening at the extreme back edges (farther back than I use so it is not a big deal).

    Bill

  3. #3
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    Default Ellsworth on Tormek

    Bill,
    I guess I didn't make myself clear. This procedure is for when you own a
    Tormek and a Crown "Ellsworth Grind" gouge or any other tool with a 5/8" shaft and you want to sharpen it to the existing bevel and wing and not change anything. It is my opinion that it would eat up too much wheel and take too much time to change another tool to this grind on a Tormek.

    Ron

  4. #4
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    Default

    The Tormek is a great tool for putting scary sharp edges on tools. It is a horrible tool for changing the profiles. It is not that it won't work, it's that it cold take 30+ minutes.

    An easier way to do the Ellsworth would be to adapt the Oneway Wolverine (or the Ellsworth jig) to the Tormek, which is quite easy.

    I wrote a web article several years ago that talks about it and is available on the "How To" page at www.turningwood.com

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vicmarc.fan
    Bill,
    I guess I didn't make myself clear. This procedure is for when you own a
    Tormek and a Crown "Ellsworth Grind" gouge or any other tool with a 5/8" shaft and you want to sharpen it to the existing bevel and wing and not change anything. It is my opinion that it would eat up too much wheel and take too much time to change another tool to this grind on a Tormek.
    Yes, I believe that I understood you correctly. Just in case I didn't, I will further explain what I was trying to say. I do have a TORMEK and a Crown Ellsworth PM bowl gouge and an Ellsworth jig and a Delta dry grinder. My comments were directed towards taking the Ellsworth grind as it is from using the dry grinder and reproducing it on the TORMEK. The grind that I have on my Ellsworth gouge will be ever so slightly different than the grind on your's and so that will make a bit of difference on the settings on the TORMEK. Also, some users have a 65 degree angle and others may have a 55 degree angle or anything in between. Even the diameter of the stone will make a very slight difference. My point is that the exact settings on the TORMEK for each person's situation will be slightly different and if I used the exact same settings given in your reference, I would wind up grinding away more metal than I would like to + wear on the stone before I achieved a smooth bevel across the entire face. So, my final settings are a bit different than the numbers that you referenced. The protrusion that I have is about 2 3/4" and the jig setting is a bit less than 5. The angle on my gouge is 65 degrees and the stone on my TORMEK has worn to a bit more than 8 inches. I would not consider using the TORMEK to remove large amounts of metal -- that is what the dry grinder is for. I have a Sorby gouge with an Ellsworth-like grind, but I used the dry grinder to do the basic shaping. The angle on that gouge is between 55 and 60 degrees. I have found that the elliptical shape of the flute on the Sorby gouge is narrower than the Crown Ellsworth gouge so I do not get quite the same results with a Sorby gouge.

    By the way, Steve, I have adapted my Ellsworth jig to the TORMEK (or more correctly, am working on doing it). My design is a bit different from yours in that it has a BB plywood base that the TORMEK sits on in a captive position and the sliding mechanism is a bit different than the one that you have shown on your web site. I hope to finish it this weekend (if I can stay away from Rockler's long enough) and will post a picture and maybe a drawing.

    Bill
    Last edited by Bill Boehme; 05-07-2006 at 11:22 PM.

  6. #6
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    Default Shorter tool life??

    Quote Originally Posted by Vicmarc.fan
    It requires the protrusion of the tool be three inches from the SVD-!85 jig. A wooden spacer 2.05" is used to set the space between the wheel and the universal support.
    Ron
    It seems to me that the 3" protrusion is going to cost you 1" of tool life over a jig that requirea a 2" protrusion.

    The Tormek is a wonderful sharpening machine for planner blades and carving tools. If it is the only grinder you have then use it.
    I much prefer a dry grinder for sharpening turning tools.

    I have found the tormek is great for putting the negative rake on the top of a scraper. It produces a wonderful polished edge agnainst which to sharpen the burr.

    Happy Turning,
    Al
    Last edited by hockenbery; 05-07-2006 at 09:29 AM.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by hockenbery
    It seems to me that the 3" protrusion is going to cost you 1" of tool life over a jig that requirea a 2" protrusion.
    Actually not, Al. I just checked and with the TORMEK, I could sharpen until there is less usable flute left on either the Crown Ellsworth gouge or the Sorby standard bowl gouge than if I used the Ellsworth jig.

    The TORMEK jig requires only 7/8" + the ~3" protrusion. The Ellsworth jig has a 2 1/4" body length + a 2" protrusion for a total of 4 1/4". The Crown Ellsworth gouge has a usable flute up to 3 1/2" from the handle and the Sorby bowl gouge has a usable flute up to 3 3/4" from the handle. The TORMEK beats the Ellsworth by 3/8". So there (that would be equivalent to a nose in the Kentucky derby)!!

    Bill

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