How many gouges?

[John Hicks]

I have two bowl gouges; one 5/8 cryo and also a 1/2 cryo. Both are ground at 45 degrees and swept back. I'm wondering how many bowl gouges are enough? I'm sure I need at least one with a traditional grind. I wasted my money on a revolution system that rattles like my old bones, and I don't want to keep buying stuff I don't need!

 

[Bruce Perry]

John,

Out there on the edge of the Hood canal, you might look at Glen Lucas's grinding advise. I own way too many bowl gouges (for teaching), but almost half are ground in Stuart Batty's 40/40 grind, and another almost half in David Ellsworth's long side grind, and I keep two in the straight across "traditional" grind, at nearly 90 degrees for bottoms of narrow bowls. So to answer your question, LOTS OF GOUGES IS ALMOST ENOUGH!

Seriously, Those three grinds will serve most folk well, at one each, the extras just allow more folk to work, or delayed sharpening sessions while you work through the pile. More importantly, settle on the shapes and learn how to reliably sharpen each style, so you don't have to keep re-learning the tool each time you sharpen.

 

[hockenbery]

I have two bowl gouges; one 5/8 cryo and also a 1/2 cryo. Both are ground at 45 degrees and swept back. I'm wondering how many bowl gouges are enough? I'm sure I need at least one with a traditional grind. I wasted my money on a revolution system that rattles like my old bones, and I don't want to keep buying stuff I don't need!

If you plan to do bowls with a 45 degree front bevel you will need a bottom of the bowl gouge because you cannot ride the bevel very far down the sidewall maybe 1/3 to 1/2 way to the bottom center depending on the bowl shape.

An Ellsworth grind or Michelson grind will get you all the way from rim to bottom center on a hemispherical shaped bowl.

I use a 1/2” Ellsworth ground gouge(5/8 bar dia) and 3/8” spindle gouge on all bowls.
I use a 1/4” Michelson ground gouge(3/8” dia) for the top first inch of the inside wall on a second turned bowl.

I use a 1 1/4 round nose scraper when needed- basically when The gouge is lifting fibers from highly figured grain and I have to stop repeated cuts with gouge before the bottom gets too thin.

 

[Bruce Perry]

I guess someone needs to say this: many grinds work, consistency is your best friend. The sooner you settle on working grinds, and learn how to do them reliably, the sooner you can start cutting cleanly while thinking "design" instead of re-learning a tool. Friend Stuart Batty will remind you that the 40 degree angle is easier to push, David Ellsworth will show the one gouge does everything process, and Glen will show all the tools a production Bowl turner uses. All are useful, and fun to experiment with.

I would argue that learning to grind with a good jig is much easier, Glen Lucas has great advise on that subject, as does Kirk Deheer, both worth checking out. Platform, or freehand grinding is absolutely worth learning, but, to my way of thinking is an advanced turners skill, best saved for a little later in the learning curve.

 

[hockenbery]

I would add to @Bruce Perry advice
Take a quality class or work with a mentor.

Use the grind and tools you are taught to use until You get good with them.
Then begin to experiment.

 

[Tim Connell]

Very good advise above. My advise after 2.5 years of turning is get a bottom feeder and you are good to go for a while.

Early on in my turning, I started reading about all the different grinds and tools and barely understood what all the new terms/grinds meant and definitely didn't understand the implications of the differences between them. Didn't stop me though from regrinding tools and trying many grinds. Got to a point that I couldn't hardly turn a bowl.

Re ground everything back to one bevel angle using one setting on the vari grind (except bottom feeder)and turned many, many bowls. I now plan to pick up a bowl gouge or two and start experimenting with a couple of different grinds and see how they perform for me, in the manner I work.

One other recommendation - when you get to a point you want to try different grinds, leave your current gouges alone and pick up an inexpensive (Benjamin's Best is what I get) gouge that you won't feel bad about grinding lots of metal. I would much rather grind a $25 tool than a $90 tool while I am experimenting.

 

[Richard Coers]

Depends on what bowl profile you turn. I turn all mine with an cantenary curve. No need for a "bottom feeder" (hate that term). If you turn a vertical wall or calabash style, you may need another.

 

[Doug Freeman]

Shaft diameters to reduce confusion - 5/8” and 3/8”. 40 and 60 deg each size with wings for shear scraping. 70 deg bottom feeder. Heal gRound away for clearance on all of them. Have a 1/2” from when I didnt know any better.

Same recommendation as above to get cheap tools, ben’s best recommended, to try out different grinds and learn about them.

It doesnt help that there isnt really a standard for bowl gouge grind names (not that Im aware of - different people have different “standard names”).

 

[Dean Center]

You only NEED one. However, see all the helpful comments above.

I recommend you have at least two of your go-to bowl gouge. Many times, especially turning green to finished, you will not want to stop and resharpen your gouge. If you have two, then when the first is no longer working well, you can switch to the other one and continue getting clean cuts or finish cuts with no interruption or extra time.

 

[Tom Albrecht]

"How Many Gouges" was the question from the OP. My answer would be, as many as you can afford in similar sizes and grinds. Personally, I like to have a few tools sharpened and ready to switch out with a quick change collet tool holder. Then I don't have to stop and re-grind as often.

 

[Bruce Perry]

Just one more comment,

The clubs I've attended, all in Colorado, have amazing connections for the new turner, mentoring programs, libraries, and truly good turners more than ready to assist in getting up to speed. You are fairly near some of the best turners on the planet, so check the listing, and make the trek to visit your (not very) local clubs, they are worth the effort.

It took only a few seconds to find the Olympic Peninsula Woodturners, their front page mentions several really fine people, who happen to be really fine turners/teachers also.

 

[John Torchick]

Interesting thread.
A recent issue of the AAW magazine had an article by Glenn Lucas on bowl turning. A great tutorial but he used several different tools to turn one bowl. I'm greatly limited in my tool collection.

 

[John Hicks]

Lots of good advice!

 

[Russ Braun]

If you don’t like buying new-fangled things, come to the AAW in Louisville. The Tradeshow will help you break that bad habit and help you understand why you need to buy everything!

 

[John Torchick]

It is amazing to see all the tools in the background of YT videos.
Mentioned this before regarding turning. If/when you go to the AAW symposium in KY, you must stop by the Hillerich & Bradsbury plant to see Louisville Slugger bats made! It's west of the downtown area.

 

[Mike Johnson]

View a Russian or India woodturning video and you will notice these accomplished turners use 2 or 3 tools at the most to turn all of the items they make.

 

[John Torchick]

Have posted one here where a guy uses a skew, sharpened with a file. Lathe is a foot treadle type.

 

[john lucas]

I do most of my turning with very few tools. A thompson 1/2"V a thompson 3/8" detail.gouge. a spindle roughing gouge a parting tool , skew and lately a Henry Taylor 1/2" bowl.gouge ground to a 40/40 grind.

 

[Bill Boehme]

Have posted one here where a guy uses a skew, sharpened with a file. Lathe is a foot treadle type.

A fellow club member had a W.F. & J. Barnes Velocipede and I was allowed to turn on it once. In the excitement I had a runaway treadle, lost my balance, and toppled off the seat. For my carelessness I was banned from using the Velocipede thus ending my foot powered turning career. Ever since, I have been relegated to using electric motor powered lathes.


There is a serious safety lesson here. Way back then safety was entirely the responsibility of the machine operator and machines were expected to be dangerous. The unguarded drive belts are an obvious unnecessary hazard, but a not-so-obvious hazard is what got me in trouble. The seat sits on a slender steel rod held in place with a wing nut. The wing nut came loose, the seat came loose from the steel rod, and as I fell the steel rod rammed me right in the middle of my chest. Fortunately, my sternum was tough enough to prevent serious injury, but the lathe owner who witnessed the whole calamity thought that I had been impaled. I obviously used up one of my nine lives.

 

[Paul Gilbert]

I am just one more gouge away from greatness! When I run out of new shapes, sizes and grinds to buy, I'll probably start over with duplicates.

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

A fellow club member had a W.F. & J. Barnes Velocipede and I was allowed to turn on it once. In the excitement I had a runaway treadle, lost my balance, and toppled off the seat. For my carelessness I was banned from using the Velocipede thus ending my foot powered turning career. Ever since, I have been relegated to using electric motor powered lathes.

View attachment 32221
There is a serious safety lesson here. Way back then safety was entirely the responsibility of the machine operator and machines were expected to be dangerous. The unguarded drive belts are an obvious unnecessary hazard, but a not-so-obvious hazard is what got me in trouble. The seat sits on a slender steel rod held in place with a wing nut. The wing nut came loose, the seat came loose from the steel rod, and as I fell the steel rod rammed me right in the middle of my chest. Fortunately, my sternum was tough enough to prevent serious injury, but the lathe owner who witnessed the whole calamity thought that I had been impaled. I obviously used up one of my nine lives.

Almost killed by a lathe that belongs in a museum. Do we have a video of the incident? Joking aside, I'm glad you did not get hurt.

 

[John Hicks]

It is amazing to see all the tools in the background of YT videos.
Mentioned this before regarding turning. If/when you go to the AAW symposium in KY, you must stop by the Hillerich & Bradsbury plant to see Louisville Slugger bats made! It's west of the downtown area.

I WISH I could go!

 

[robo hippy]

Well, if you have only one bowl gouge, you want one with a 60 degree bevel. This works for most bowls except for really deep ones. That nose angle will allow you to go down the inside of a bowl, through the transition, and across the bottom. For me, I prefer two gouges. I have come to rely more on the 40/40 grind as it just cuts better than the 60 degree angles. The 40/40 works fine on more shallow pieces, like plates and platters, but won't make it through the transition and across the bottom on deeper bowls, and that holds true even if you grind off most of the heel. This is where you need a bottom feeder, which I thought was some one's 'trade name', or a BOB (bottom of bowl) tool. I use a 70 degree bevel on mine. The nose profile is like this ), so slightly curved and not square across the top like a spindle roughing gouge. I don't use the swept back gouges at all. The swept back edge works great for a high angle shear/slicing cut, and okay for shear scraping, but I prefer specialized tools for that. Size matters some what, but I prefer the 5/8 inch gouges. They just feel better in my hands, and can do heavy roughing if you don't use scrapers like I do.... How powerful your lathe also matters here as well. Many are comfortable with 1/2 inch gouges. Depends on what works best for you...

robo hippy