Norton 3X grinding wheels

[Steve Worcester]

Anyone use these? I just picked up a 120 grit (a bit too fine for my tastes) and it seems real soft. I usually grind 5-8 gouges at a time and I had to reface it twice during my last sharpening session.

 

[Vince Welch]

Hi Steve,

I am not using the Norton wheels yet but this is good information as I am starting to look at replacment wheels. I see these are not ceramic wheels(SG). Were you using aluminum oxide (white) wheels before? If so, are these much different then AO wheel you have used in the past?

Vince

 

[MichaelMouse]

WELL! You certainly don't want to do a search with three Xs in it, do you? Or was that what you were after with your post, Steve?

Confusion supreme. They are the ceramic alumina according to http://www.nortonconsumer.com/Data/Element/Product/product.asp?ele_ch_id=P0000000000000001983 , but all that's mentioned in the bond department is - nothing. My chief complaint with the Norton white is the soft bond and short life. While I'm willing to assume, on principle rather than use, that fracture patterns in synthetic crystals can freshen the edges while maintaining the integrity of the bond to the whole, that's not quite the claim I'm seeing. Guess that's why the question was asked?

Where's the compromise between life and cut? For me it's still green, not blue.

 

[odie]

I also have a couple of 120gt white wheels that I just didn't know any better before I bought them. The problem with 120gt, is they tend to heat your tool quickly and ruins the temper of the edge and burr. For me, the edge they leave is real fine, but the sharpness doesn't last very long....dull quickly. Attempting to "speed sharpen" doesn't work too well.....I'd rather go a little slower, with more control.

The white wheels I'm using now are of unknown grit.....the label is unreadable. It works fine, but I'm unsure of what grit I've been using.

I am about to purchase a couple of the Norton SG 80gt (I think) wheels I see on CSUSA. They are expensive at 70 bucks a pop. I found them locally, but at the same price. Anyone know of a cheaper source that would be worthwhile to pursue?

If anyone is currently using the Norton SG wheels. I assume the 80gt would be the one to get, but is there any advantage to the 46gt??????

I am about to place an order, so your responses are appreciated.

....odie

 

[Brodie Brickey]

Odie,

Try www.cuttingedgetools.com in Texas. You'll probably need to call them, but their prices have been very reasonable.

Steve: My wheels are blue (80 grit) and Pink (120 grit) that I got at WoodCraft. I don't know if they're SG or what, but the 120 is basically useless. Way too fine and I'm constantly overheating the steel. I'm on a 3650 RPM grinder though...

Hope that helps.

 

[Steve Worcester]

I am about to purchase a couple of the Norton SG 80gt (I think) wheels I see on CSUSA. They are expensive at 70 bucks a pop. I found them locally, but at the same price. Anyone know of a cheaper source that would be worthwhile to pursue?

lower grits would be for reshaping and 80 or 120 for all around sharpening. If you have found them locally at the same price, buy them locally. Te Norton SG is a great wheel from what I have been told (Stuart Batty highly recommends them...)

From Oneways website on wheels
http://www.oneway.on.ca/sharpening/wheels.htm
"If you grind mostly large tools with a large contact area on the grinder, such as skews, flat scrapers and carpenter chisels, choose 54 grit for roughing and 80 grit for finishing.
For grinding small tools, and for finishing large gouges, choose the 80 and 120 grit wheels. "

 

[Gordon Seto]

Has anybody compared the Norton 3X SG from Hartville Tools to the SG from CSUSA side by side? They are only 40% of what CS is asking for. Those from CS are real nice - cut fast, do not load up, run cool and resist grooving. The only downside is the big price tag. Since the big price gap, are we comparing the same product?

Gordon

http://www.hartvilletool.com/product/10846


Super Cool Blue 3X Wheels: Controlled micro fracturing of the wheel grain of 3X wheels provides a constant, sharp supply of patented SG (ceramic alumina) grain cutting points. This superior performance product has the highest wheel life, and combines an exceptionally fast cut rate with burn free grinding. Excellent for grinding plane blades, chisels, and turning tools on a bench or pedestal grinder. Handles all the hard, tough, and difficult to grind tool steels which are used for most premium plane blades, including A2. For best wheel dressing results use Norton’s Multi-Point Diamond Dresser. USA

 

[Jeff Schutzman]

Norton 3X Wheel from Hartville

I had heard the many positive comments about the Norton 3X wheels, and decided to give it a try. I ordered the 100grt wheel from Hartville because of the better price point.

The 1" diameter wheel showed up packaged as expected but its diameter was slightly less than 1" advertised. There where a couple of postings about this happening with Norton wheels and I contacted Hartville about the specific issue. They hadn't heard of the problem, but offered a refund if I wanted it.

I decided to keep the wheel, and to moun it on my 1750 RPM grinder. So the wheel was balanced, then mounted, and then trued with the Oneway diamond tool.

I was very surprised to find that this wheel is very soft, very susceptible to grooving and very difficult to keep flat and true. In fact just today I trued the wheel around noon and by this evening had lightly sharpened (not shaped) a 3/8 bowl gouge about 5 times and the wheel is noticeably cupped.

I am hoping to learn that these wheels are not the ones that have been so highly recommended by so many turners and that are different in some way. In any case at the rate it is going the 8" wheel I have will be less than 6" in a few weeks and then it will go into the trash.

Jeff

 

[rbabbittjr]

I've had the Norton SG 80 wheels from Craft Supply for years and have been very happy with them. Ever since the 3X wheels came out I have wondered if they were the same wheels at a new lower price because of better production methods. Sounds like they are different wheels. I don't shape my tools that often so opted for two 80 grit.

 

[odie]

I've had the Norton SG 80 wheels from Craft Supply for years and have been very happy with them. Ever since the 3X wheels came out I have wondered if they were the same wheels at a new lower price because of better production methods. Sounds like they are different wheels. I don't shape my tools that often so opted for two 80 grit.

Two of the 80 SG wheels.....that's exactly what I've been thinking, since I have a scraper jig on one side, and a gouge jig on the other.

Thanks for the responses.

....odie

 

[Gordon Seto]

The 1" diameter wheel showed up packaged as expected but its diameter was slightly less than 1" advertised.

Jeff

I think you meant 1" width.

I have the 80 grit from CSUSA. Compared to the OEM that came with the Woodcraft slow speed grinder, the SG wheel doesn't have to be dressed as often. I am extremely satisfied with it. The arbor is 5/8" which is the same diameter as the grinder shaft. I can't use the Oneway balancer with it; CSUSA claims that the SG wheels are already balanced that we don't need to balance them.

Too bad, they are not the same thing. Otherwise I am tempted to replace the other wheel if the price is more affordable.
Gordon

 

[Steve Worcester]

I am getting the distinct feeling that the SG and 3X are very different products in the Norton line.

 

[rbabbittjr]

I do not know. During Stuat Batty's last visit to us I am pretty sure he suggested the 3X wheels because of the price. I do not know if had actually tried them or was just looking at the price. Grinding wheels usually have the grading numbers on them. Do the SG wheels? I don't feel like taking my grinder apart at the moment.

 

[Gordon Seto]

I am getting the distinct feeling that the SG and 3X are very different products in the Norton line.

Steve,

See my earlier post #7 in blue color.
Super Cool Blue 3X Wheels: Controlled micro fracturing of the wheel grain of 3X wheels provides a constant, sharp supply of patented SG (ceramic alumina) grain cutting points.
That is direct quote from Hartville product description. It also mentioned "3X" and "SG" in the same sentence on the outside of the Norton 3X box.

The SG wheels from CSUSA is grayish blue color; the 3X SG from Hartville is light turquoise color.

Perhaps there are different grades of SG wheels.

Gordon

 

[Barry Elder]

3X Norton Vitrified Wheels

If you go to the Norton website and look up vitrified wheels you can get more info and be sure to look at the bottom where the types of bonds are listed. It seems some of the wheels out there are made with a lesser type of bond so that some of the wheels are even more friable. At least that's what I interpret. When I was selling hardware, the Norton SG Wheel was the top of the line and we never had any complaints. Now I buy my wheels through Grainger as they have the catalog and their prices are very good also.

 

[Frank F]

Has anybody compared the Norton 3X SG from Hartville Tools to the SG from CSUSA side by side? They are only 40% of what CS is asking for. Those from CS are real nice - cut fast, do not load up, run cool and resist grooving. The only downside is the big price tag. Since the big price gap, are we comparing the same product?

Gordon

I wondered the same thing, so I contacted Norton. They told me that the difference is the proportion of Seeded Gel to AO. 30% SG for the 3X wheels and 50% SG for the 5SG wheels.

I wouldn't use the 3X wheels to sharpen turning tools because their hardness is "I". My understanding is that 5SGK wheels are the ones recommended for high speed turning tools.

Frank

 

[Jerry Hall]

Make sure you get the "K" grade

I had the 3X 120 grit I grade. Way to soft.
here is a spec for K 80 grit: http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/Norton-3X-Blue-Grinding-Wheel-K-Grade-P101C20.aspx
So far so good.
And here are some long discussions on this subject from Wood Central:
http://www.woodcentral.com/cgi-bin/archives_turning.pl?read=143309
http://www.woodcentral.com/cgi-bin/archives_turning.pl?read=141948

 

[jdsilwones]

Steve,
I tried a Norton 60g SG and it grooved and spit sand. Dressing it required a face shield! I turn allot and sharpen more then most so this was not a good wheel for me. I installed a CS 80g 3X last week and am very pleased. 100 is too fine for me, a 120 wood be more like a honing stone

 

[robert davis]

steve i have an 80 grit sg from packard. i like it better than any other i have used. it is not soft.

 

[Vince Welch]

Other Wheels

Not to take away from Steve's original post but I was wondering if anyone is using Oneway's Blue wheels and if so I would like to hear some feedback.

Thanks, Vince

 

[Dave Peebles]

Hi Vince,

I just ordered two yesterday. I am hoping to have them in a day or so. I will let you know how I like them after a spin or two.

Will you be at Ray's this year?

Best wishes,
Dave

 

[Vince Welch]

Hi Dave,

I will be at Ray's all day Saturday. I am really looking forward to being there. It is a great time!

Vince