beginning sand blasting

[Steven Forrest]

I am interested in trying some sandblasting. I have a newish Husky 20 gal compressor, 4 cfm @90 psi, 165 max pressure. Can I use this for blasting? Recommended equipment? How long would it take to blast a basic cereal bowl, just for general reference? Thanks, all.

 

[Vincent Vogel]

Check out eastwood.com or harbor freight. Their small siphon feed units require 7cfm @ 90 psi. Your compressor might do what you want to do but it will run constantly and just be slower at doing the job. I don't know how long it would take. Wood cuts a lot easier than rust. I haven't done wood sandblasting, I'm sure someone else here has and can advise on further details

 

[hockenbery]

I am interested in trying some sandblasting. I have a newish Husky 20 gal compressor, 4 cfm @90 psi, 165 max pressure. Can I use this for blasting? Recommended equipment? How long would it take to blast a basic cereal bowl, just for general reference? Thanks, all.

Yes, but…. No one ever complains about having too large a compressor.

That compressor will get you started. I use a similar style compressor for a while and in quite a few demos.
I suggest you get a cabinet. It will let you recycle the media and keeping it in one place.
I recommend coarse ground glass as the media.

Blasting with a small compressor is a bit like hollowing. In hollowing you often spend more time blowing chips out that cutting. Blasting with a small compressor you spend more time waiting for the compressor to recharge than blasting.

There are many things you can do with sandblasting and sand carving.
I wrote an article on sandcarving for the journal - December 2016.

Woods all blast differently
Bill Luce, deceased, created a fantanstic skeleton series blasting Doug fir

This is a video clip from a demo. Uses the harbor freight table top cabinet and a small compressor
Also shows application of a resist. The minutes of recharging of the compressor is cut from the clip
sandcarved painted disk -

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9HPtoI3Z5A

 

[hockenbery]

Recommended equipment? How long would it take to blast a basic cereal bowl, just for general reference?

Blasting the out side of 6” Bowl 4-10 minutes of blasting
Waiting for your compressor to recharge 8-20 minutes making the total time 12-30 minutes

This will give you insight into what I do as well as equipment.

http://swat.hockenbery.net/SWAT%20Sandcarving.pdf

You should be able to find enough coupons get this cabinet for under $150.

Benchtop Abrasive Blast Cabinet

Amazing deals on this Abrasive Blast Cabinet at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

A few examples of sand carving.


Be careful. There are many opportunities to spend money once you fall down the sandblasting rabbit hole.

 

[Daniel Henry]

From my personal experience, I fear your compressor may be a bit undersized.

From my personal experience, Hockenbery's comments are TOTALLY on point.

Using a cabinet and recycle the blasting median; the environment will thank you!

 

[Chris Lawrence]

Using a cabinet is for more then recycling material. Sandblasting is messy if you don't have something to contain it. The blasting material bounces off and goes everywhere. If you don't use a cabinet you need to be in a open area and have on protective clothing, face shield, and respirator.

 

[Steven Forrest]

Thanks so much for the info and advice, folks!

 

[Kalia Kliban]

Steve, Chimera Arts in Sebastopol has a nice big sandblasting cabinet. A 1 month membership would cost way less than buying a rig and would let you try it on for size. Jolie Karno recommended 80-grit garnet medium for blasting on wood when I was asking about this over in the WiT forum.
KK

 

[Richard Coers]

Sandblasting is like cutting the end off your hose and expecting the compressor to keep up. How long can you keep a blow gun open before the compressor can't keep up? That is the best evaluation for you to make.

 

[hockenbery]

Sandblasting is like cutting the end off your hose and expecting the compressor to keep up. How long can you keep a blow gun open before the compressor can't keep up? That is the best evaluation for you to make.

How long would it take to blast a basic cereal bowl,

Use Richard’s suggestion to get a pretty accurate timing for your compressor.

Find the minutes for the compressor to come on, then time the recharge time.
Then see what the wait times you would have for 4 minutes of blasting and then for 10 minutes of blasting.
An 1/8” nozzle on the blast gun will be close in air use to a blow gun.

Blasting the out side of 6” Bowl 4-10 minutes of blasting
Waiting for your compressor to recharge 8-20 minutes making the total time 12-30 minutes

A small compressor makes you wait a lot. I used a small one until I wanted to do lots of blasting.
Still use a small one in demos but do very little blasting in demos..

I got a 60 gallon Quincy. When it comes on it adds air faster than I use it so it recharges.
I also added a pressure pot which uses a little less air and is a bit more consistent in media delivery than the siphon feed.

I also bought a vinyl cutter to cut masking.

Once you find out if you want to do a lot of blasting the you can buy a bigger compressor
If you want to blast 1 piece a month you little compressor may work just fine for you.

If you go the chimera arts route it makes this discussion moot.

 

[John DeSalvo]

If you do use a 20 gal compressor, it will run hot trying to keep up and produce water vapor that will eventually start to clog your siphon because the media will clump up. At least that is what used to happen to me before I got an 80 gallon unit.

 

[John Baxter]

@hockenbery in the images above you shared I like that wooden globe on the 2nd very much, do you own this?

 

[hockenbery]

@hockenbery in the images above you shared I like that wooden globe on the 2nd very much, do you own this?

I think that one was one I had in the instant gallery at the Florida symposium a few years ago. I ended up gifting it to a longtime woodturning friend who saw it and wanted it.

The globes got me into sandcarving. My attempts at making globes with pyrography were ok but not crisp enough.
Using google to find a company that I could pay to cut masking led me to uscutter.com - bought a tabletop cutter.

It’s easy to reproduce a similar one.
If you are interested in making one start a conversation - you need a ball and access to a blast cabinet.

 

[Dave Hulett]

I am interested in trying some sandblasting. I have a newish Husky 20 gal compressor, 4 cfm @90 psi, 165 max pressure. Can I use this for blasting? Recommended equipment? How long would it take to blast a basic cereal bowl, just for general reference? Thanks, all.

I have the same husky you have. a few years ago Our club had a remote demo by on sandblasting. I was very interested until we got to discussing compressors and I realized that no one in our club of 60 members had a compressor capable of doing justice with sandblasting. I figured you'd need to spend $800-$1k to get enough preassure. But I've never tried it so if someone else here tells me it can be done with our 90 psi husky I'd love to give it a try

 

[Richard Coers]

I have the same husky you have. a few years ago Our club had a remote demo by on sandblasting. I was very interested until we got to discussing compressors and I realized that no one in our club of 60 members had a compressor capable of doing justice with sandblasting. I figured you'd need to spend $800-$1k to get enough preassure. But I've never tried it so if someone else here tells me it can be done with our 90 psi husky I'd love to give it a try

You can sandblast with any compressor, it's time that you won't like with a small compressor. With a small compressor you will have working time in seconds, big may give you a minute, and a properly sized compressor to match your blasting system will give you full time sand blasting. The old saying about hot rodding, speed is proportional to money spent.

 

[hockenbery]

was very interested until we got to discussing compressors and I realized that no one in our club of 60 members had a compressor capable of doing justice with sandblasting

You are basically correct. But a small compressor will let you blast. And wait and blast. And wait.
It’s like hollowing little bit of turning lots of chip removal. It isn’t as obvious that the chip removal is down time in the hollowing process until you turn pieces with chip evacuating voids.
The small compressor will let you know if you want to go down the blasting rabbit hole. You can spend lots of money on blast equipment.
If you blast 4-5 pieces a year a small compressor will might suit you.
The 60 gallon Quincey compressor I have is now $1300 from northern tool delivered to your driveway.

I started with a 27 gallon hausley-Cambell. 4cfm
Have used this compressor in demos many times.
The demo video above is with the little compressor.
You can see what it does.

 

[Charlie Knighton]

Estate sales may be a source for larger compressor....decide before how much u are willing to go....many times they do not come up til the end of aution.....be prepared to bid against the employees but be assured it works and good quality

 

[Steven Forrest]

I've got a line on a (barely) used HF cabinet locally. Checking it out tomorrow. Will report back if I pull the trigger. Otherwise I may take Kalia's advice and try one out at the local maker space. Thanks all for your thoughts.

 

[Steven Forrest]

Following up on this thread. I landed a barely used HF cabinet for a decent price. I've tried it out on several test pieces. Here's what I'm finding so far:
As predicted, the compressor runs a lot of the time, and/or I pause to let it catch up a bit. But it seems to be basically okay. Using the smallest of the supplied nozzles.
The drain at the bottom of the hopper is utterly useless. The only way I can trade out media is by vacuuming it out.
Glass beads were too fine (already in the cabinet when I bought it). Crushed glass 30-60 grit was still too fine. I really wanted to get some material removal. Now trying 70 grit aluminum oxide, and it seems to be more aggressive, but it also seems to be lodging in the wood and leaving some residue. The stuff is black, alas. (As I recall, the grit scale for the glass vs the adalox doesn't translate directly, hence 70 grit adalox being more aggressive than 30-60 grit glass.)
Type of wood/grain orientation really affect the look. Long grain/side grain redwood gave me really gorgeous ribbing. End grain hardwood barely showed any effect at all.
So - any suggestions for aggressive media/supplier that doesn't embed/leave a residue? Someone recommended garnet to me. I'm all ears.
Thanks, team!

 

[hockenbery]

any suggestions for aggressive media/supplier that doesn't embed/leave a residue?

You probably know that blast media gets dull with use. I go to new media after 3-5 uses.
i added a pressure pot so I know how many times I put it through the pot. With siphon feed it’s hard to know how many times it was reused Sort of a guessing game.

as you noted - lots of variation with different woods and grain orientation. I like the pebbly look really hard woods like citrus or red gum eucalyptus get from blasting.

here is what I use



Here is chart on Raptorblaster.com showing the ballotini 3





this was an experiment with different grits on a camphor disc for a box top insert
the back ground was blasted with coarse ground glass
the pink wing panels were blasted with fine ground glass.

 

[Steven Forrest]

While I'm at it, I would like to clarify: The blast cabinet has a side port into which I can jam my 2 1/2" shop vac hose end. It also has a baffled port at the back that is larger, and was supplied with a stopper. My impression is that I should leave it open while the vacuum is on to allow air flow in, but that if I weren't running a vacuum, I would stop it to prevent media leakage to the outside. Is that correct? (The cabinet manual doesn't address this.)

 

[hockenbery]

While I'm at it, I would like to clarify: The blast cabinet has a side port into which I can jam my 2 1/2" shop vac hose end. It also has a baffled port at the back that is larger, and was supplied with a stopper. My impression is that I should leave it open while the vacuum is on to allow air flow in, but that if I weren't running a vacuum, I would stop it to prevent media leakage to the outside. Is that correct? (The cabinet manual doesn't address this.)

Funny you should bring this up.
I use my fein shop vac on my cabinet.
last week i was doing a short 5-10 minute blast. Forgot to remove the baffel plug before turning on the vac.
sucked both gloves inside the cabinet. But one glove was secured less tightly than the other and it pulled the hose clamp off.
It added 10 minutes to re-attach the glove. Of course it was the far one.

i Leave that baffle plug in when I blast without the vac. Which I could have done last week.
I also leave the plug in when I’m not using the cabinet because my shop has lots of small visitors I don’t want in the cabinet.
Skinks, anoles, mud dobbers.

 

[Ric Williams]

Glad I saw this thread. I'm starting to shop around for a new compressor and blasting cabinet. I was thinking about a full size compressor like the Quincy 60 gallon, but I wonder about the noise level when it's running. I haven't found any noise level specs for those. If it's anything like the big compressor they had where I used to work, I wouldn't want to be in the same room with it.
I have hearing issues, so things like loud compressors are really uncomfortable for me. I've got a mid size California Air quiet compressor that I just use for a blow gun at the lathe and workbench and it's fairly quiet, but runs a lot just for single blow gun use. They make some big ones capable of 10cfm, but all they do is put 2 or even 3 compressor/motor assemblies on it. That's a lot of extra parts to wear out or break down. Still, if I don't find any better choice noise-wise, and don't find enough negative reviews to take as a warning, I may have to consider one.

 

[hockenbery]

Glad I saw this thread. I'm starting to shop around for a new compressor and blasting cabinet. I was thinking about a full size compressor like the Quincy 60 gallon,

I got my 60 gal Quincy about 10 years ago planing to put it outside and enclose it.
first thing I noticed was it was much quieter than my smaller one (27 gal??)
measure it with my Apple Watch
79&80 db. right at the compress
67 db at the blaster about 15 feet away.

here are the spec from the northern tool. Says 80 db

 

[Ric Williams]

I got my 60 gal Quincy about 10 years ago planing to put it outside and enclose it.
first thing I noticed was it was much quieter than my smaller one (27 gal??)
measure it with my Apple Watch
79&80 db. right at the compress
67 db at the blaster about 15 feet away.

here are the spec from the northern tool. Says 80 db
View attachment 51510View attachment 51509

Hey, thanks! I guess I wasn't looking in the right places for more specs. I don't mind normal machine noise levels and at my typical usage level, a full size compressor will probably come on a couple times a week.
I have a 30 year old Craftsman oil-less compressor that makes a really annoying, super loud buzzing, and I can't wait to put it out by the road with a "free" sign on it. One of the advantages of living in a rural area. If you put something in any way useful out by the road, someone will grab it.

 

[Doug Freeman]

An option not mentioned is compressors can be chained together. You dont have to get a 10 cfm compressor/tank. If you have a 5 cfm and get another 5 cfm, tie them together, you have the needed flow. I’ve done it for spray finishing furniture. You have to work out the electrical requirements and the pressures each compressor cycles at, and one needs to have a fitting in the tank to accept output from the other, but its not difficult to do.

 

[Kevin Jesequel]

I got my 60 gal Quincy about 10 years ago planing to put it outside and enclose it.
first thing I noticed was it was much quieter than my smaller one (27 gal??)
measure it with my Apple Watch
79&80 db. right at the compress
67 db at the blaster about 15 feet away.

here are the spec from the northern tool. Says 80 db
View attachment 51510View attachment 51509

I bought this model last summer and have it right next to my blaster. I agree that it is much quieter than I anticipated. I wear hearing protection while blasting just because the combination of the shop vac and the compressor running together is a bit much, plus it’s a great activity to do while listening to music. My lathe is across the shop and when the compressor kicks on while blowing shavings out of a hollow form, it is not bothersome at all.

 

[David Martin]

Use Richard’s suggestion to get a pretty accurate timing for your compressor.

Find the minutes for the compressor to come on, then time the recharge time.
Then see what the wait times you would have for 4 minutes of blasting and then for 10 minutes of blasting.
An 1/8” nozzle on the blast gun will be close in air use to a blow gun.



A small compressor makes you wait a lot. I used a small one until I wanted to do lots of blasting.
Still use a small one in demos but do very little blasting in demos..

I got a 60 gallon Quincy. When it comes on it adds air faster than I use it so it recharges.
I also added a pressure pot which uses a little less air and is a bit more consistent in media delivery than the siphon feed.

I also bought a vinyl cutter to cut masking.

Once you find out if you want to do a lot of blasting the you can buy a bigger compressor
If you want to blast 1 piece a month you little compressor may work just fine for you.

If you go the chimera arts route it makes this discussion moot.

When doing the math don't forget to factor in the duty cycle of your compressor, which in your case is likely not more than 50%. Try to run it continuously and you will be shopping soon. I have a 5hp 80 gal Champion compressor that I picked up used for $400. It's a commercial pump and is more like what you want for sandblasting, it keeps up with my blast cabinet just fine. Good deals are out there!

 

[Steven Forrest]

Let me restate my question: What is your experience as far as blast media embedding itself in the wood and essentially leaving a residue? Is there a way to avoid this or minimize it? Aluminum oxide (black) really seems to be prone to this. Is garnet any better? Or glass? Or would it work to blast with glass after aluminum oxide?
Thanks again.

 

[hockenbery]

Let me restate my question: What is your experience as far as blast media embedding itself in the wood and essentially leaving a residue? Is there a way to avoid this or minimize it? Aluminum oxide (black) really seems to be prone to this. Is garnet any better? Or glass? Or would it work to blast with glass after aluminum oxide?
Thanks again.

coarse ground glass doesn’t imbed in the wood surfaces I’ve blasted with it. It cuts and bounces off.

some times there will be a little dust ( mostly wood dust) on pieces especially if I have several pieces in the cabinet. The first ones blasted gather dust.
I usually blow the pieces off with compressed air - if I plan to paint the background with the resist in place I use a light touch on the blow gun so as to not lift the resist before painting. If i have thin lines in the resist that are prone to blowing off i blow the dust off with the airbrush before putting paint in it.

if there are voids or cracks the glass can get in those. Air blows those out.

most of the time I seal the openings of hollow forms to keep the glass out.
when I have blasted resist images inside a wide mouthed hollow form. A lot of glass and dust is left inside the form. i pour it out and blow it out but since I don’t sand the inside i probably don’t get all the glass out but maybe. I paint the inside with an airbrush.

I used some garnet a long long time ago ago for getting a textured surface. i don’t remember it getting in the wood.
I know some turners use garnet.

i haven’t used aluminum Oxide and I haven’t blasted the same area with different media.

 

[Ric Williams]

Does anyone know of a reputable place where I can order a Quincy air compressor? I've been checking everywhere I can find, but the places like Northern Tool, Air Compressors Direct and Global Industrial get terrible online reviews for order processing and customer service, and Quincy's dealer list seems to be all industrial suppliers for their big air systems. Other dealers I've found sell them, but want $300 for shipping!

 

[Kevin Jesequel]

I ordered mine from Northerntool and did not have any problems. You may want to call compressor dealers near you and see if any carry Quincy and deal with the public direct.

 

[hockenbery]

I got mine from northern tool no problems at all. That was years ago and things change but my delivery went fine.
I did not pay the extra for a lift gate.

guy showed up with the compressor on a pallet jack put It in my garage.

compressor was bolted to a small pallet and was easy for me to move on a hand truck with the pallet attached.
lakeland now has a northern tool storefront.
bought a jack there.