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Elbo tool
- Thread starter Jim Keenan
- Start date
I have seen it demonstrated and it can work well.
I say it "can" because like many tools, getting it tuned is the secret to success. In this case, it is adjusting the joints so they pivot freely, but not so loose that they have slop vertically.
Nick Cook will be demonstrating this tool at the Southern States Symposium on April 28th, so you might get some more detailed answers after that. However, I doubt Nick would demo it if it was a poor tool.
I say it "can" because like many tools, getting it tuned is the secret to success. In this case, it is adjusting the joints so they pivot freely, but not so loose that they have slop vertically.
Nick Cook will be demonstrating this tool at the Southern States Symposium on April 28th, so you might get some more detailed answers after that. However, I doubt Nick would demo it if it was a poor tool.
Looks like one step closer to a CNC machine (IMHO)captjim said:
I have one of these Purchased it at Highland about two month ago. When I use it I expect the teacher to grab me and take me to the office for cheating.
There are two neetle bearing thust washers at each of the joints so mine was no trouble to get it working right. The nuts are ni-loc and were set up correctly when I took it out of the box.
I love the thing.
Stan
There are two neetle bearing thust washers at each of the joints so mine was no trouble to get it working right. The nuts are ni-loc and were set up correctly when I took it out of the box.
I love the thing.
Stan
i have one and enjoy working with it, i am still learning with it 
I like mine, but I'm also still quite a novice at hollow forms and I've never used a captured system to compare it to. I certainly don't have anything negative to say about it.
One HUGE plus in my book -- I can use it with the lathe practically up against the wall. My Nova DVR is on the front half of an 18inch deep bench and the elbo tool has enough clearance to operate. My sense of most captured systems (correct me if I am wrong) is that you really need to have access to the rear of the lathe from time to time. Shop size constraints made this an easy choice for me that I have not regretted.
One HUGE plus in my book -- I can use it with the lathe practically up against the wall. My Nova DVR is on the front half of an 18inch deep bench and the elbo tool has enough clearance to operate. My sense of most captured systems (correct me if I am wrong) is that you really need to have access to the rear of the lathe from time to time. Shop size constraints made this an easy choice for me that I have not regretted.
Richard Baker
RIP
Just Some Thoughts
Looks good from engineering viewpoint (from the still pictures) if bearing slop is ~zero, and grip on the tailstock quill is solid without damaging same. They will perhaps want to offer a curved "boring bar" as well as the straight bar. Appears less cumbersome than a "captured" system.
Looks good from engineering viewpoint (from the still pictures) if bearing slop is ~zero, and grip on the tailstock quill is solid without damaging same. They will perhaps want to offer a curved "boring bar" as well as the straight bar. Appears less cumbersome than a "captured" system.
Are you using the tools that came with the tool or have you substituted Proforme, Molly Munroe, etc.?
Thanks for the imput. My senior citizen shoulders and arms may take a liking to this.
Thanks for the imput. My senior citizen shoulders and arms may take a liking to this.
whitefence said:
OOOOOOPPPppppppsssssss
I WAS WRONG (ok?)!
Now that I have looked at the youtube.com video, I see that this is quite an interesting tool. Kind of like a cross between a bowlsaver and one of those big outrigger devices. Looks VERY interesting.ByGeorge said:
I WAS WRONG (ok?)!
I've been able to try the elbo tool out at a couple of symposiums and like it a lot. You can control the cutting with just finger tip pressure; it's very smooth. It is so smooth that the laser depth gauge mounts onto the tool with a magnetic base. No screws, clamps, or other mechanical fasteners are needed to keep the laser aligned with the cutting tip of the tool.
One of the nice things about the elbo tool is that its maker produces adapters that will allow the elbo tool to use virtually any hollowing tool on the market. Your Kelton, Jamison, Woodcut, and other cutters can be used with the elbo tool serving as the "handle" for your cutter. This makes the tool very flexible and does not lock you into one "system".
Having said that, I still don't own an elbo tool for the following reason: I have a short-bed lathe. The elbo tool takes up more "lathe space" than other captured systems because the elbo tool has to fit between the tail stock and the head stock. (With other captured systems, the "secondary tool rest" can be mounted where your tail stock otherwise might be.) This configuration gives the elbo tool about 6" - 8" less capacity than other captured systems and it means the elbo tool won't fit on a short bed lathe without a bed extension.
A work around is to make a stand, similar to what you might use to support a tool rest for outboard turning, for the elbo tool to latch on to in lieu of the tail stock. I just haven't had the time to make one of those, so I haven't ordered the elbo tool. Yet.
One of the nice things about the elbo tool is that its maker produces adapters that will allow the elbo tool to use virtually any hollowing tool on the market. Your Kelton, Jamison, Woodcut, and other cutters can be used with the elbo tool serving as the "handle" for your cutter. This makes the tool very flexible and does not lock you into one "system".
Having said that, I still don't own an elbo tool for the following reason: I have a short-bed lathe. The elbo tool takes up more "lathe space" than other captured systems because the elbo tool has to fit between the tail stock and the head stock. (With other captured systems, the "secondary tool rest" can be mounted where your tail stock otherwise might be.) This configuration gives the elbo tool about 6" - 8" less capacity than other captured systems and it means the elbo tool won't fit on a short bed lathe without a bed extension.
A work around is to make a stand, similar to what you might use to support a tool rest for outboard turning, for the elbo tool to latch on to in lieu of the tail stock. I just haven't had the time to make one of those, so I haven't ordered the elbo tool. Yet.
There's more than one . .
Vicmarc make something similar, but it's not on thier web site. They show it in the VOD 300 DVD, but I've never actually seen it and don't know if it's any better or not.
Vicmarc make something similar, but it's not on thier web site. They show it in the VOD 300 DVD, but I've never actually seen it and don't know if it's any better or not.
They will perhaps want to offer a curved "boring bar" as well as the straight bar. Appears less cumbersome than a "captured" system.
they have an adapter so you can use hook tool from different systems, i bought one of 1/4 inch size and hook boring tip (its about 2 or 3 inches long) but have not needed it yet, i imagine if i went more wide than deep i would need it then, i only have 14 inch swing over bed so i do not do anything gigantic
about 11 or possible 12 inches deep is the max with the tool, comfortable 8 to 10, anything over 8 and need to move the tool rest up slightly
a 3 wheel hollow form steady is very useful, this can be built, but does get in the way of lazer systems
they have an adapter so you can use hook tool from different systems, i bought one of 1/4 inch size and hook boring tip (its about 2 or 3 inches long) but have not needed it yet, i imagine if i went more wide than deep i would need it then, i only have 14 inch swing over bed so i do not do anything gigantic
about 11 or possible 12 inches deep is the max with the tool, comfortable 8 to 10, anything over 8 and need to move the tool rest up slightly
a 3 wheel hollow form steady is very useful, this can be built, but does get in the way of lazer systems
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Thanks for the input. I am going to order Elbo direct from the maker since he has all of the accessories at his shop. I talked with his wife today to ask some questions and she was very pleasant. Stan Townsend, the manufacturer, responded promptly to my question via e-mail. This sounds like a guy with a good idea who is trying to make it happen. I would rather pay full retail to him to maximize his profits than buy from the catalog where he would have to discount the price to them.
I noticed you signature quote from Captain Cook. We live just a few miles from Kealakakua Bay, where he met his demise at the hands of the Hawaiians.
The Hawaiians believed that they could capture the mana from a brave and worthy enemy by eating the flesh of the long bones. After the fine meal, they delivered the bones back to the ship as a sign of respect.
Most fishermen have special names for fishing â€Âspotsâ€Â. We refer to Kealakakua as the “Kitchenâ€Â.
I noticed you signature quote from Captain Cook. We live just a few miles from Kealakakua Bay, where he met his demise at the hands of the Hawaiians.
The Hawaiians believed that they could capture the mana from a brave and worthy enemy by eating the flesh of the long bones. After the fine meal, they delivered the bones back to the ship as a sign of respect.
Most fishermen have special names for fishing â€Âspotsâ€Â. We refer to Kealakakua as the “Kitchenâ€Â.
baitbegger said:
Captain Cook
Capt Cook was an interesting fellow, who was good at what he did, and i always felt he looked forward to tomorrow and what that day held.
I noticed you signature quote from Captain Cook. We live just a few miles from Kealakakua Bay, where he met his demise at the hands of the Hawaiians.
The Hawaiians believed that they could capture the mana from a brave and worthy enemy by eating the flesh of the long bones. After the fine meal, they delivered the bones back to the ship as a sign of respect.
Most fishermen have special names for fishing â€Âspotsâ€Â. We refer to Kealakakua as the “Kitchenâ€Â.
he was talking about the new guinea natives when he made statement about the natives who were cannibals, he dealt with many different people and seemed to observe and take people as they were and many were cannibals, also euopeans were fixated and wanted to hear about cannibals
Capt Cook was an interesting fellow, who was good at what he did, and i always felt he looked forward to tomorrow and what that day held.
I noticed you signature quote from Captain Cook. We live just a few miles from Kealakakua Bay, where he met his demise at the hands of the Hawaiians.
The Hawaiians believed that they could capture the mana from a brave and worthy enemy by eating the flesh of the long bones. After the fine meal, they delivered the bones back to the ship as a sign of respect.
Most fishermen have special names for fishing â€Âspotsâ€Â. We refer to Kealakakua as the “Kitchenâ€Â.
he was talking about the new guinea natives when he made statement about the natives who were cannibals, he dealt with many different people and seemed to observe and take people as they were and many were cannibals, also euopeans were fixated and wanted to hear about cannibals
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Dissenting Opinion
Well, having just finished watching the video, I'm a bit surprised that ByGeorge withdrew his original assessment of this "machine".
It may not be CNC but it's far too much automation to appeal to me. OK, maybe I'm a purist, and I certainly don't mean to be unkind, but using this device is not, IMHO, woodturning as an art form. The finished piece may be worthy of being called "art" based upon it's design, but the use of this instrument as a wood turning tool does not impress me as artistic process.
Well, having just finished watching the video, I'm a bit surprised that ByGeorge withdrew his original assessment of this "machine".
It may not be CNC but it's far too much automation to appeal to me. OK, maybe I'm a purist, and I certainly don't mean to be unkind, but using this device is not, IMHO, woodturning as an art form. The finished piece may be worthy of being called "art" based upon it's design, but the use of this instrument as a wood turning tool does not impress me as artistic process.
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Having looked at the video, I determined that the device is REALLY little more than a more secure variation of an outrigger. You still have to guide the tool to make it work properly, and you can still blow through into "negative space" if you misuse it. If it were automated, I would have had a different opinion.nuturner said:
Since I am fairly new to this forum I am in the dark about the meanings of CNC and IMHO. Could someone enlighten me?
I guess I’m not a purist but I also don’t consider myself an artist nor, I suspect, would anyone else. But I do like to make sawdust and have some fun turning firewood into something useful. I ordered the tool today and, after I play with it a while, I put in some feedback.
If I ever find that I am fitting into the “artist†category, I will make sure I convert the Jet 1642 to a treadle operated lathe and the chain saw and bandsaw will be replaced with a good old buck saw.
I guess I’m not a purist but I also don’t consider myself an artist nor, I suspect, would anyone else. But I do like to make sawdust and have some fun turning firewood into something useful. I ordered the tool today and, after I play with it a while, I put in some feedback.
If I ever find that I am fitting into the “artist†category, I will make sure I convert the Jet 1642 to a treadle operated lathe and the chain saw and bandsaw will be replaced with a good old buck saw.
nuturner said:
look here
http://www.acronymfinder.com/
this site is useful for this board and a host of other times, just copy and paste the acronym you are interested in
i believe someone posted this site before because i learned of it here
http://www.acronymfinder.com/
this site is useful for this board and a host of other times, just copy and paste the acronym you are interested in
i believe someone posted this site before because i learned of it here
captjim said:
I'm not sure to what extent you are serious, but CNC is for Computer Numeric Controlled. There are CNC lathes which are driven through CAD and programming rather than the "tool in your hand" skillset. Understand that the CAD and programming take skill - they just do not generally appeal to the hobbiest/artist.
The allusion is often used for different levels of automation or convenience features.
A common example is the lathe duplicator which is more like running the machine that copies keys in a hardware store than the experience most of us have when we are turning. If you need to make 500 identical parts on a schedule for your livelihood, this would be a great asset. Most turners I know wouldn't have much enthusiasm for using a duplicator.
Obviously, these are all useful methods and have there place.
Steve Worcester
Admin Emeritus
captjim said:
First. welcome.
Next, IMHO is "In My Humble Opinion". A common way to express what you don't like without trying to upset others (it still will).
You will find that we tend to talk in code sometimes, not unlike the "kids today" that can text message on a cell phone at a rate of 1000/month and 100 words per minute, by using what the now have established as common abbreviations.
Don't be afraid to ask if you don't understand, the only dumb question is the one the other guy asked.
Automation? hardly?
I bought one and I like it. Like a captured system it keeps the tool level and keeps it from twisting. The turner has to direct where the tool goes and clean the shavings out of the hollow form. I can feel how the tool is cutting more than I thought I would. I like to use the laser on it to get a nice wall thickness. I think John Jordan describes making hollow forms well. Making the outside is fun and creative. Hollowing the inside is just plain work.nuturner said:
Art form, yes
I look at it as the hollowing of an art form that has been created. I ordered this system today.
nuturner said:
I look at it as the hollowing of an art form that has been created. I ordered this system today.
I have one and it works great
I bought one of these because it look like a great engineering solution. I visited several of the woodturners in our club and the hollowing systems they have looked really complicated and hard to setup/store.
My elbo tool was up and running in 15 minutes after unpacking. Vicmarc demonstrated a similiar setup at the AAW show. The guy that sells these in Oklahoma City is very helpful. His web sit didn't help me at all. It seems to expect you to have a lot of hollowing experience.
Highly recommeded addition. I also added the laser system and have used it for two large segmented bowls with great results. I had to get in to smooth out the join between the two halves.
I bought one of these because it look like a great engineering solution. I visited several of the woodturners in our club and the hollowing systems they have looked really complicated and hard to setup/store.
My elbo tool was up and running in 15 minutes after unpacking. Vicmarc demonstrated a similiar setup at the AAW show. The guy that sells these in Oklahoma City is very helpful. His web sit didn't help me at all. It seems to expect you to have a lot of hollowing experience.
Highly recommeded addition. I also added the laser system and have used it for two large segmented bowls with great results. I had to get in to smooth out the join between the two halves.
john lucas
AAW Forum Expert
There will be a new hollowing system on the market before very long. I is similar to the elbow tool but much more versatile and will allow you to hollow a piece 8 or 10 inches on a mini lathe without having any sort of bed extension like the elbow tool sells for the mini lathe. I just found out that they are planning to unveil it at the Ohio symposium in November. Some of us got a preview of the tool at IndyFest. I shouldn't say any more but if you are thinking about a captured bar system I would hold out a little longer.
Regarding this new hollowing system who is coming out with it, Vicmarc, Elbo?
How will it be more versatile?
How will it be more versatile?
I will surely echo what John Lucas said. I've also seen this new system and will have my order in as soon as it's available.
john lucas
AAW Forum Expert
Adam they are still looking or a company to build it so nobody knows who is going to build or market it yet. It has twice the movement and more rigidity than the elbow tool.
Where do you draw the line to determine what tool (instrument) being used is still pure turning and not? Is using a bowl gouge not pure turning then because at one time, there were only scrapers for turners to use before the gouge. But wait, scrapers must not be pure either because stones were used before that.
john lucas
AAW Forum Expert
Sean I'm going back to carving with chipped Obsidian. Now that's true turning. Besides the ladies in my office are conviced that's the stock I come from.
Besides the ladies in my office are conviced that's the stock I come from.
Sean I'm going back to carving with chipped Obsidian. Now that's true turning.
Actually, that may not be a bad idea. Somehow incorperate the stone into the finished turning after using it to carve with. You may be on to something.
WhatWhereWhen?
Exactly what event are you referring to John? Enquiring minds need to know.
Exactly what event are you referring to John? Enquiring minds need to know.
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I know I'm bumping a fairly old post here but I'm really curious about how you see this as "automated" in any way? I recently tried out one of these as well as a captured hollowing system at a club meeting and to me neither of them seemed to be in the least bit automated.
Jason