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Looking for advice - how to fix in finishing - tear out?

Alex Bradley

Alex Bradley

Joined
Oct 28, 2021
Messages
43
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128
Location
Louisville, CO
Hello,

I am hoping that someone has some advice on how I can fix the finish on a piece. I am really hoping to bring it to the symposium. I turned this piece from one of my dad's rough turned bowls. I think that it has been drying since 1995 (so it was dry). Assuming maple. I sanded to 1200 and applied Osmo oil. The oil did not penetrate evenly and there are what look like tear out along the end grain that follows the growth rings. I have not had this happen on a piece before. I did try to repair but taking off the first coat of Osmo, applying a hardner, resanding and reapplying the Osmo. Same thing.

Two questions -
- Can anyone tell me why this happened? My only guess is that it was from sanding - I am using an orbital sander with 3" disks up to 400 and then hand sanding 600, 800, 1200. I do turn the lathe speed way down when sanding but maybe not enough??? If that is it the most likely cause, how do I prevent in the future?

- I have Liberon black bison wax and was thinking of applying it over the Osmo. I am hoping that this might even out the finish and "hide" those spots. I have not used wax before so not sure if it would work. I would be buffing by hand and do NOT want a high gloss.


Thank you!!!!!!
Cheers,
Alex
 

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Looks like Maple. Those aren’t sanding issues or tear-out. They are soft spots, not sure the cause. I suspect it might be early spalt or rot areas. Notice they happen in a pattern related to the grain in those areas. The wood at those spots seems softer and a bit coarser, so even sanded perfectly, will look different.

I would let your finish settle, harden a bit, then recoat to fill and level. The spots will remain. It’s what maple does.
 
Marc Banka said:
Looks like Maple. Those aren’t sanding issues or tear-out. They are soft spots, not sure the cause. I suspect it might be early spalt or rot areas. Notice they happen in a pattern related to the grain in those areas. The wood at those spots seems softer and a bit coarser, so even sanded perfectly, will look different.

I would let your finish settle, harden a bit, then recoat to fill and level. The spots will remain. It’s what maple does.
Click to expand...
Thank you! This makes me feel a lot better. The Osmo oil really doesn't seem to level. Do you think wax would?
 
So annoying when that happens.
Alex Bradley said:
Thank you! This makes me feel a lot better. The Osmo oil really doesn't seem to level. Do you think wax would?
Click to expand...
It might not "level" like a surface film finish, but you may be able to get more to penetrate. I'd work with the Osmo at least in that area and see if more coats help. Buffing might also help even the finish across the spots. But like Marc and Lou say, it's probably just wood being wood, so they're unlikely to go away.

Oh, and bring it anyway
 
Alex Bradley said:
Thank you! This makes me feel a lot better. The Osmo oil really doesn't seem to level. Do you think wax would?
Click to expand...
I agree, I don't think that Osmo will really fill a pit and level out. It's not so much a film forming finish as say polyurethane or lacquer. I don't think the wax will, either, and if it did, I don't think it would harden.

I've had maple do this to me, too. And like others, I think it's just a soft or punky spot in the wood. If you notice them earlier on in the sanding process you can work the spots with some focused sanding (sand paper and finger tips), but you may still be left with spots that appear a little lighter or darker in color. One trick you can use in the future is to wipe down the surface with mineral spirits which simulates the appearance of a finish coat. Use raking light, too. I tend to use the MS after I hit 220g. This may help catch some of these spots earlier.

I really like your Dad's work, so I'm sorry I'm not going to Portland; I'd love to see this.
 
One of your problems with Osmo is that you sanded to 1200 before applying it. I used to sand to at least 800 and was not impressed with the Osmo finish.
Then I was informed that sanding to 320 (or 400 max) was best for this product. Finish sand along the grain to removed the usual scratches. I have recently started
dipping a piece of the 320 sanding pad in Osmo for that final sand/first Osmo coat and the finish has been excellent.
 
Graham Dolby said:
...I used to sand to at least 800 and was not impressed with the Osmo finish.
Then I was informed that sanding to 320 (or 400 max) was best for this product. ...
Click to expand...
My experience has been quite different. I regularly sand to 1200 and apply two coats of Osmo Polyx-Oil satin. I have been quite happy with the results, but we may be after different outcomes. I'm curious what you didn't like about your earlier finishes?
 
Mark Jundanian said:
I agree, I don't think that Osmo will really fill a pit and level out. It's not so much a film forming finish as say polyurethane or lacquer. I don't think the wax will, either, and if it did, I don't think it would harden.

I've had maple do this to me, too. And like others, I think it's just a soft or punky spot in the wood. If you notice them earlier on in the sanding process you can work the spots with some focused sanding (sand paper and finger tips), but you may still be left with spots that appear a little lighter or darker in color. One trick you can use in the future is to wipe down the surface with mineral spirits which simulates the appearance of a finish coat. Use raking light, too. I tend to use the MS after I hit 220g. This may help catch some of these spots earlier.

I really like your Dad's work, so I'm sorry I'm not going to Portland; I'd love to see this.
Click to expand...
Thank you Mark!!!! I am trying to establish myself and have an Instagram page if you happen to be on social media. I am still needing to get a proper photography set up made but hope to have that and document his finished pieces. Hope to meet another time. Oh, and the instagram is @fineturnedwood
 
Graham Dolby said:
One of your problems with Osmo is that you sanded to 1200 before applying it. I used to sand to at least 800 and was not impressed with the Osmo finish.
Then I was informed that sanding to 320 (or 400 max) was best for this product. Finish sand along the grain to removed the usual scratches. I have recently started
dipping a piece of the 320 sanding pad in Osmo for that final sand/first Osmo coat and the finish has been excellent.
Click to expand...
Oh that is a great tip!! I will try that on my next one. Thank you!
 
Alex Bradley said:
Does the shellac prevent the oil from penetrating?
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Only slightly, because thinned shellac will also soak into the wood. A watery consistency is just right. If you put on too much shellac and it builds a surface film you can knock it back with a light sanding. After that the oil will penetrate evenly, though not as deeply, which is what you want to even out punky spots in the wood. For very punky spots you can dab on some thicker shellac before or after the washcoat.
 
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Mark Jundanian said:
My experience has been quite different. I regularly sand to 1200 and apply two coats of Osmo Polyx-Oil satin. I have been quite happy with the results, but we may be after different outcomes. I'm curious what you didn't like about your earlier finishes?
Click to expand...
I liked the finished look but the first coat didn't seem to soak in at all and I was advised to stop sanding much earlier. In fact I think the Osmo brochures also recommend a 320 finish.
Incidentally, when turning pens I used to sand to 1200 or even higher. However, I found that medium CA glue finishes sometimes had a tendency to peel off when re-sanding. Again, I was advised to stop sanding much earlier.
 
Not sure what finish will really remove tearout; only sanding or possibly shear scraping. The tearout appears to be rather deep; thus tons of sanding. If you can't put it back on the lathe, then I'd maybe try tinting CA glue and try filling with that.

For the future, when sanding all imperfections that you don't want to show when finishing must be eliminated with the coarsest grit sandpaper; in this case 80 or even 60 grit. Finer grits just won't remove those pits.
 
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