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Odd Noise When Turning

D

Dan Witrock

Joined
Dec 15, 2022
Messages
9
Likes
3
Location
New York City, NY
Hi,
For a couple weeks I noticed that my when my lathe was set to a lower rpm that it was much harder to turn the handwheel than in the past. At fast speeds I wouldn't notice it at all (once I had obviously turned the machine back off again).
Then a week ago I noticed that there's somewhat of a high pitched sound that goes in and out. Is this related? Are they two separate problems I need to deal with? Any idea how to fix either? Has the pulley gone bad?
There is a link to a sound file that I recorded of the noise.

Audio Link to Noise
https://soundcloud.com/dan-w-4%2Fnew-recording-81
View: https://soundcloud.com/dan-w-4/new-recording-81?si=803911cc750440af948ea0c73a694672&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing


I use a Jet 14"x42" JWL-1442VS.

I guess I just never remembered it being difficult to turn the handwheel before. Does something need oil or something? Or you think I just never realized beforehand that I was on a lower RPM.

Any suggestions would be wonderful.

thanks!
- dan
 
Also, to actually clarify, it's not that it's harder overall to turn the handwheel, but specifically as you turn it, it's difficult in only part of the full turn... like a section of it gets stiff as you're doing a full rotation. So that's why i'm worried there's an issue with one section of the belt?... and thus it needs to be replaced... which I feel like is a big headache, since i've never done it...
Hopefully that's not the case... any ideas?
 
Dan Witrock said:
Also, to actually clarify, it's not that it's harder overall to turn the handwheel, but specifically as you turn it, it's difficult in only part of the full turn... like a section of it gets stiff as you're doing a full rotation. So that's why i'm worried there's an issue with one section of the belt?... and thus it needs to be replaced... which I feel like is a big headache, since i've never done it...
Hopefully that's not the case... any ideas?
Click to expand...

Just a wild guess here, but is it possible one of the pulleys has slipped to one side a bit.....just enough that it only makes contact with the lathe on part of the revolution?

-----odie-----
 
Following up on Odie's comment - Your high pitched noise (squeal?) could well be a mis-aligned belt, if you got a pulley "wandering" off from where it should be. (Don't read too much into my noise diagnostics - I'm deaf as a brick wall, have been since I was 6 years old.. but funny thing I found working on small engines, cars, and heavy trucks, I was actually pretty good at locating noise issues! Go figure.)
 
Ahh. a Reeves drive. Yeah they'll be noisy eventually, no two ways about it, you can minimize with some maintenance and lubrication (BTW removing belt is not difficult at all, but have yourself a block of wood handy, maybe 1/4 inch thick - used to hold the spring loaded pulley separated so you can fit the belt over the other pulley easily) Not much of adjustment to them unless motor mounts on slotted mounting holes - once they start to slip and lose torque, it's time to change belts. If you ever dealt with many snowmobiles (and many Polaris CVT transmissions) it isn't much different from their drive systems. but proper alignment on some can be a bit fussy (and rather important, actually - Plenty of times I had to re-align the pulleys on the Polaris machines , thankfully they had a special alignment tool that made the job relatively easy. )

Odie (and I) , in prior posts, were likely thinking of newer model lathes that had 3 pulleys on each shaft and a ribbed flat belt which many machines had.
 
Ah gotcha. What kind of lubrication is best for these? Do I use grease or a lubricating oil? I assume I would just apply it in between the pulleys?

Thanks
 
Since the increased resistance is in only part of the revolution of the spindle, it's possible that one of the sheaves is out of true or bent. (The 2 sheaves make up the variable pulley in the Reeves drive.) The sheaves are made of a particular metal that is less durable than usual steel and prone to damage. As Gerald mentions, the shaft that the moving sheave slides on needs periodic lubrication, but that generally shows up as a problem of difficulty changing speeds.
 
Dean Center said:
Since the increased resistance is in only part of the revolution of the spindle, it's possible that one of the sheaves is out of true or bent. (The 2 sheaves make up the variable pulley in the Reeves drive.) The sheaves are made of a particular metal that is less durable than usual steel and prone to damage. As Gerald mentions, the shaft that the moving sheave slides on needs periodic lubrication, but that generally shows up as a problem of difficulty changing speeds.
Click to expand...
Is it easy to tell if one of the sheaves is out of true or bent? And if it's just out of true, is that possible to fix myself? Or I basically just need to buy new sheaves from Jet...
 
Dan Witrock said:
Is it easy to tell if one of the sheaves is out of true or bent? And if it's just out of true, is that possible to fix myself? Or I basically just need to buy new sheaves from Jet...
Click to expand...
I'd sooner buy a new lathe without the reeves drive - Can't really fix the sheaves yourself without a machine shop, though mechanically inclined persons can generally figure out disassembly and reassembly - easier to deal with once you understand how reeves drives work. I doubt you'd find individual sheaves; you'd probably have to buy the whole reeves drive assembly, and I'd bet the cost would be nearly half the price you paid for that lathe.....

You do need to make sure to not get any lubricant on the drive belt (any petroleum will rot it quickly)

It's difficult to get lubrication onto the shaft with the belt in place, so removal of belt helps (google it, probably several YouTube videos on belt changes on a reeves drive or jet lathe) and then just apply a bit of lubricant (NOT oil, it'll fling off and contaminate belt - As well, no excess lubricant which can also melt and fling off onto belt, as well as collect dust)
On my HF lathe, I used a dry graphite spray I picked up at auto parts store (it sprays on wet then quickly dries) and that generally lasts quite some time. Mine is probably far noisier than yours, but I only notice a problem when it gets so bad that it wants to vibrate (as slightly loose belt jumps in the grooves) or slip, or just plain hard to change speeds.

As far as seeing if the sheaves are out of true or bent, again remove belt, you can then spin by hand.. but chances are that one spot when it is hard to turn may well just be a very slight wear spot on the drive belt (if sides of belt wear unevenly, typically due to stalling the lathe - motor spins and it acts like locking up your brakes on highway - you get flat spots on your tires) so belt naturally will fall deeper into groove (and other sheave set will narrow up) and then when you turn into the wider part of the belt, you feel resistance because the opposite drive sheave must then separate against spring pressure - So, worn belt can also cause that problem (might even be source of your noise?) May be worth getting a spare (new) drive belt - also likely at auto parts store - I see the size on it 9.5mm width x 640mm length it appears, which I am sure could be translated pretty close to a FHP V-Belt , since 640mm is just about 25.19 inch and 9.5mm is close to .37 (roughly 3/8) it'd probably work out to a 3L250 FHP Belt (FHP = Fractional Horse Power)
 
Dan Witrock said:
Hi,
For a couple weeks I noticed that my when my lathe was set to a lower rpm that it was much harder to turn the handwheel than in the past. At fast speeds I wouldn't notice it at all (once I had obviously turned the machine back off again).
Then a week ago I noticed that there's somewhat of a high pitched sound that goes in and out. Is this related? Are they two separate problems I need to deal with? Any idea how to fix either? Has the pulley gone bad?
There is a link to a sound file that I recorded of the noise.

Audio Link to Noise
https://soundcloud.com/dan-w-4%2Fnew-recording-81
View: https://soundcloud.com/dan-w-4/new-recording-81?si=803911cc750440af948ea0c73a694672&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing


I use a Jet 14"x42" JWL-1442VS.

I guess I just never remembered it being difficult to turn the handwheel before. Does something need oil or something? Or you think I just never realized beforehand that I was on a lower RPM.

Any suggestions would be wonderful.

thanks!
- dan
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if you are mindful of belt dressing of the varying types for varying speeds. I found that this helped tremendously with unwanted noises from speed changes on the belt drive.
 
Dan Witrock said:
Is it easy to tell if one of the sheaves is out of true or bent? And if it's just out of true, is that possible to fix myself? Or I basically just need to buy new sheaves from Jet...
Click to expand...
Years ago, I spent a lot of time inside the 1442 lathes at our high school woodshop, but it was mostly related to the speed changing lever. It's been a while since we've had a discussion on the forum about Reeves drives and even longer since I worked on the Reeves drive on the Delta lathe at our local senior center. There are others on the forum who can provide better advice than I on this problem. Brian, for one, Bill Boehme, for another that I recall having knowledge in this area. You might get helpful info by searching on "Reeves Drive" here on the forum.

The really sad part is that, no, you cannot fix the sheaves. If they go bad, the part has to be replaced. There are no replacements for the old Delta lathes, and I don't know if Jet still has them available at this point. Creative fix-it guys may have developed solutions, but I don't know what they might be.
 
With your Reeves drive, when in slow speed, you are trying to turn the motor fast and with significant friction when turning the spindle by hand. When in fast speed, you are turning the motor much slower when turning the spindle by hand. Both of the Reeves drives I had were noisy by comparison.
 
I don’t have a reeves drive, but was getting a very similar noise. My lathe has a screw in spindle lock, and it was not out far enough. So the tip would just touch the pulley.
 
Parts for a 1442 Reeves are not available or at least as rare as hens teeth. Looked at the pullies when I had a 1442 about 8 years ago and you could get individual sides. Looked again before i sold it and here were none available. The halves were around $80 each as I remember. A good lathe but the pullies made of pot metal.
 
I hear a chirping noise, and I suspect it changes occurrence with speed change. I suspect the belt is squeaking at a certain spot during rotation of the drive system (most likely a wide or narrow spot has developed in the belt) which causes the pulley to move slightly in response to the belt width. The noise can be belt sliding against the pulley, the pulley rapidly cycling in/out, or a combination.

The pulley movement should be observable with the cover removed. A new belt and cleaning/lubing the shaft/moveable pulley will most likely take care of it. Pulleys are probably ok.

What you feel in the handwheel might be related. My HF reeves drive lathe made the same noise and had the same feel in the handwheel, and the culprits were as described above.
 
Doug Freeman said:
I hear a chirping noise, and I suspect it changes occurrence with speed change. I suspect the belt is squeaking at a certain spot during rotation of the drive system (most likely a wide or narrow spot has developed in the belt) which causes the pulley to move slightly in response to the belt width. The noise can be belt sliding against the pulley, the pulley rapidly cycling in/out, or a combination.

The pulley movement should be observable with the cover removed. A new belt and cleaning/lubing the shaft/moveable pulley will most likely take care of it. Pulleys are probably ok.

What you feel in the handwheel might be related. My HF reeves drive lathe made the same noise and had the same feel in the handwheel, and the culprits were as described above.
Click to expand...
Thanks so much Doug. Yea, "chirping" sounds like a good description of it. Did you just use lithium grease for lubing the shafts?
 
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