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Sanding pad blues

John Hicks

John Hicks

Joined
Jan 23, 2020
Messages
695
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975
Location
Shingletown CA
I have tried several pads for my inertia sanders; they fall apart, the Velcro stops sticking, and they seem to be a bit too soft. Do any of you recommend backing pads that are well made? I ordered from amazon and I can't remember where I got the other set.
 
I get my abrasives and discs from Vince Welch/VincesWoodNWonders. I prefer the blue discs. Ken Rizza sells a lot of abrasives, and another turner here, whose name escapes me sells the Mirka brand. A couple of things about sanding, I use firm interface pads for grits up to 180 or 220, then medium pads up to 400. If I go above 400, which is never for daily use bowls, I switch to the soft pads. When sanding, slow speeds work better. This is all about traction. At too high of speeds, the abrasives don't get a chance to dig in and cut, kind of like a dragster burning off its wheels.... All of my bowls are warped, and I can't keep abrasives on them above about 15 rpm. If you have pretty round bowls, I wouldn't go above 500 rpm, and would actually go a lot lower than that. Also, you want minimal pressure, the weight of your arms is too much. This generates heat, which destroys the hooks on your pads, and can cause cracks in the wood. Only use enough pressure to get the abrasives to cut. I always use an 'interface' pad. The main pad is usually the expensive one, so you use a cheap one on top of it which serves as a use it till worn out and replace item.

robo hippy
 
I'm using interface pads from
vinceswoodnwonders.com

Home - VincesWoodNWonders.com

Simply stated, Vince's Wood N' Wonders is in the service business! One of my goals is to provide superior personalized customer service! At
vinceswoodnwonders.com vinceswoodnwonders.com
that are years old.
Talked to Vince's the other day and he reminded me that he has actual sized disks, oversized (the ones I prefer), and marked disks.
His interface pads come in different densities and edge profile.
 
I recently got the sanding kit kit from Woodturners Wonders and it's been great so far. The mandrels and sanding pads - both regular and soft - work great and I don't see tearing apart anytime soon and if they do over time: the kit comes with materials to repair them, as well.
 
What rpm are you running the lathe? Too fast and too much pressure will melt the hooks. If it doesn't feel like the sand paper is biting into the wood, the wood is spinning too fast. I'd suggest you buy a new hook pad for the sander, and also buy a new interface pad. Then slow the lathe way down and put about zero pressure on the sanding pad. Too many folks think they have to muscle the sander to get it to cut. All you do with heavy pressure is mess up the hook and loop and the sanding actually goes slower.
 
I was having problems too. I slowed my lathe way down and the sanding pads last a lot longer. I also end up with a better result on the piece I am sanding.
 
I'l second the idea of slowing down when sanding - too much heat can soften the glue holding the pad, melt the hooks and rise hell with hardware. It also isn't good for the wood - causing micro cracks at the worst.
 
I was having similar problems years ago and ended up with a long phone call with Vince Welch. He said what Richard and Rusty and Jeff posted. Too much heat. Slow down and apply less pressure. For me it was the pressure rather than the speed.
 
And just adding to the topic, too much pressure, whether with power or inertial sanding can cause "over sanding". I'm sure there is a proper name, but that's the term I use to describe what happens with a wood like oak, when the early wood is abraded more than the late wood, causing a rippled effect.
Does anyone have a better name for this, or a better description?
 
I pretty much handsand, but I think I may be guilty of using too much pressure as well. I am begining to think this may be a contributing factor to persistent scratch marks.
 
robo hippy said:
I get my abrasives and discs from Vince Welch/VincesWoodNWonders. I prefer the blue discs. Ken Rizza sells a lot of abrasives, and another turner here, whose name escapes me sells the Mirka brand. A couple of things about sanding, I use firm interface pads for grits up to 180 or 220, then medium pads up to 400. If I go above 400, which is never for daily use bowls, I switch to the soft pads. When sanding, slow speeds work better. This is all about traction. At too high of speeds, the abrasives don't get a chance to dig in and cut, kind of like a dragster burning off its wheels.... All of my bowls are warped, and I can't keep abrasives on them above about 15 rpm. If you have pretty round bowls, I wouldn't go above 500 rpm, and would actually go a lot lower than that. Also, you want minimal pressure, the weight of your arms is too much. This generates heat, which destroys the hooks on your pads, and can cause cracks in the wood. Only use enough pressure to get the abrasives to cut. I always use an 'interface' pad. The main pad is usually the expensive one, so you use a cheap one on top of it which serves as a use it till worn out and replace item.

robo hippy
Click to expand...

I've read several statements from very experienced turners who say they use firmer pads up to 180 or 220 and softer pads above that. I certainly don't question that, given their level of experience, but I guess I don't understand it logically. I would think you'd want less firmness for the courser grits to minimize excessive deep scratching and could get away with more firmness with the finer grits, but I'm obviously missing some important point about sanding. Anyone care to clarify why it works that way? I understand why slower speeds work better and I tend to sand in the 200-250 rpm range, but pad firmness sound like it works oppositely of what I would have expected.
 
Ric Williams said:
I've read several statements from very experienced turners who say they use firmer pads up to 180 or 220 and softer pads above that. I certainly don't question that, given their level of experience, but I guess I don't understand it logically. I would think you'd want less firmness for the courser grits to minimize excessive deep scratching and could get away with more firmness with the finer grits, but I'm obviously missing some important point about sanding. Anyone care to clarify why it works that way? I understand why slower speeds work better and I tend to sand in the 200-250 rpm range, but pad firmness sound like it works oppositely of what I would have expected.
Click to expand...
Logically I would think about it like the difference between a 600 grit and 180 grit CBN grinding wheel or driving.

The 600 removes material faster which seems counterintuitive. Like racing or driving a vehicle, think about bumpy road vs a smooth one. The finer grit takes less pressure to get over the bumps and valleys because they aren't as extreme - and heats up faster due to more continual surface contact. The contours are finer, less extreme. A softer pad follows the finer contours. Less peaks and valleys on a micro level the finer the grit. Off-road vs drag strip. My 2 cents.
 
With some experimenting, I found out that 120 grit on a firm pad cuts better/faster than 80 grit on a soft pad. Not exactly sure why. I think part of it has to do with the coarser grits are for leveling and taking out tear out and tool marks. The problem with softer pads is that they conform to the shape of the wood. If you are trying to remove marks in the transition area, the softer pads will have more pressure on the wall of the bowl and the bottom, and very little on the transition. When you get to the finer grits, you are mostly trying to remove the scratch marks of the coarser grits, and when you get over that 400 grit range, you are pretty much polishing out scratch marks and not 'really' sanding, if that makes sense.

robo hippy
 
Ok, those both make sense. I'm still a hack at sanding (but getting better), so my first thought was that I'd probably do more harm than good with a course disk on a firm pad, but I'll just add to the list of techniques that I need to work on some more.
Thanks for the explanations!
 
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