Wood characteristics in general and in reference to rings

[Raif Harik]

Hi, I recently made a ring out of bacote. It looked quite nice. As I was showing it off, someone said "oh, bacote? is that pretty brittle?" I said "... hell I don't know". Well not long after I two half rings which is not as good as one whole ring. I also made a ring out of mesquite. I've been discussing the finish used in this thread. Sadly that ring ended this morning. Not sure what did it, and it's actually still holding on i.e. it's just broken in one place so it's still a circle.
So that has me wondering,
a) what is the opposite of brittle?
b) what woods are the opposite brittle?
c) is the opposite of brittle actually an important characteristic for ring durability?
d) what characteristics would make a ring more durable?
e) what wood have those characteristics?

This could splinter into a couple of other directions e.g. orientation of the wood ( this feels very hard to describe in relation to a ring ) and does a finish add strength to a ring. I'll leave that up to responders if they want to explore that.

Thanks,
Raif

 

[John K Jordan]

Some wood I think is tough, although I haven't made rings:
Dense, fine grain wood: Ebony, olivewood, lignum vitae, argentine lignum vitae, dogwood, mopani, desert ironwood, cocobolo.
Wood with narrow interlocked grain might work well. But some species, like cocobolo, are known to be allergenic sensitizers.
Wildly and finely figured burl seems pretty resistant to splitting. Stabilizing/strengthening with thin CA? Again, speculations no based on no experience.

Opposite of brittle is flexible, pliable (and strong, of course!)

Are you generally using face grain (across the diameter) or end grain (parallel to the finger)?

Seems to me one characteristic to make a wooden ring more durable would a lamination of maybe three layers, the layer in the middle at 90-deg to the top and bottom. A piece of veneer might be nice. Could be a contrasting or complementary color or darkness. (That even works if the top and bottom layers have vertical rather then horizontal grain orientation. I've done this when gluing up various non-ring things)

Might be easy to test different methods by cutting a ring-sized and -shaped piece and try bendng or abusing it before spending the time to make it beautiful.

Hey, how about writing a short ring-making tutorial with some photos. This might inspire a ring-making community! (I can guess but have no idea of the best way to go about turning a ring.)

JKJ

 

[Ron Solfest]

One wood I’ve been thinking about for a ring but haven’t tried is hickory, I think interlocking grain would be a plus. Actually, the first one I turned was supposed to be hickory: a friend gave me an old cutoff labeled as ‘hick’ that turned out to be white oak; but I loved the look of the grain so kept making ones from that chunk. I have yet to actually try hickory

 

[Curt Fuller]

Although it's not really a wooden ring, these ring kits allow you to use any wood you want.

JDG Stainless Steel 2-Piece Ring Core

JDG ring kits are a favorite among ring makers who cater to high-end jewelry shops and collectors. Made of certified stainless steel, JDG rings feature a radiused interior profile that makes them comfortable to wear every day.The unique two-piece press-together design provides an excellent fit...

woodturnerscatalog.com

 

[Webb Willmott]

I wonder if vacuum infused resin would be an improvement (stabilizing).

Of course there is always a potential for the resin to cause skin irritation and that also carries over to any finish on the inside of a ring.

 

[Steve Tiedman]

I've never made a wood ring. But, the problem is the thinness of the wood in a ring made from any species in any grain orientation. Once you drill the finger hole, you've interupted the continuous wood fibers, then when you turn the outside, the remaining fibers are so thin that they just don't have the strength, nor mass, to support themselves anymore. This will happen drilling through the face grain, edge grain, and end grain. Regardless of the species and whether it has interlocking grain (elm comes to mind first, along with oak, or any species that resists splitting with an axe), the remaining wood is so thin that it will be brittle, no matter what...

Curt's metal ring kit shown above is probably the best way to deal with it. The metal will support the thin, extremely short wood fibers.

About the only other way to maintain strenth, theoretically, would be to bend a strip of edge grain-oriented wood into a complete circle, that circle being the finished ring size. But, getting fibers to do that around such a small radius likely won't work.

For clarity of description- if one started with a perfectly straight grain 1" diameter wood dowel rod of any species, cut a section off about 1/4" long, drilled it for the ring size (which will be parallel to end grain), turned the outside dimension to the desired ring thickness, and then imagine the always-popular drinking straw bundle analogy, by the time you're done, there just isn't enough remaining fiber to maintain strength.

I think for all practical, and structural, reasons, a metal backer to support the wood is the only realistic way to get a lasting wood ring. Then hope the wood stays stable, moisture-wise, to not shring and swell on the stable metal and crack itself anyway. Plastic-infused "stabilized" wood may be your only practical wood choice, backed by a metal ring kit. Wood rings- neat idea, but beyond its own structural capacity.

 

[Mark Jundanian]

For what it's worth, all the rings I've seen have a metal ring core.

Following on JKJ's plywood suggestion, how about Spectraply? They also make a product called Dymalux that sound interesting.

 

[Steve Tiedman]

Okay, the uneducated shadetree wood engineer in me has been thinkin'... (Uh oh.)

Laminations. In particular, wrapped laminations of very thin layers, glued together (probably epoxy, or maybe a permanent spray adhesive?).

Likely the strongest lamination will be from a vertical grain orientation, as shown in my first photo below, and explained in this website.

Lumber 101: Vertical Grain vs. Flat Grain | Lumberstore.ca

Welcome to the first post of the Lumber 101 series! This is the start of a small series of educational posts to share some of our knowledge about lumber. Today’s topic is Vertical Grain vs. Flat Grain…

www.lumberstore.ca

Back to drinking straws, a thin layer of vertical grain wood will be just like a singular layer of drinking straws on a tabletop. That layer of wood will be flexible due to the thinness, and strong due to long, uninterrupted fibers.

Enter the hand plane shavings. Shown below are some shavings (boring pine, and too wide for the purpose) from my shop floor. (They are not from a vertical grain cut board, though.) They are close enough to demonstrate how a vertical grain hand plane shaving could be glued upon itself (like a roll of tape) to form a ring. Since the wood fibers would be continuous, by the time the multi-layer lamination is cured, it should actually be very strong compare to a solid piece of wood that is simply drilled.

Thin, wispy shavings would be a pain to work with, and thick shavings may not be flexible enough. I'm guessing, but shavings in the 1/64" to 1/32" zone might be good.

A vertical grain board, 1/4" to maybe 3/8" thick, that has nice, straight face grain, with a board edge cut parallel to the face grain pattern, and a finely sharpened hand plane used with great care and moderate speed, should net nice, long, clean curly shavings. At 1/32" thick, you'd need probably 4 (5 or 6?) wraps/laminated layers, and for an average finger size that shaving should probably be a good 12-16" long.

A turned dowel made to the ring size, and then wrapped with waxed or parchment paper, would work to form to glued ring and still be able to release it from the dowel. Might have to clean the paper out of the inside diameter of the ring. Very little to no lathe work involved here, but maybe the final rough ring shape can be lathe mounted for final shaping and finish.

Phew, I'm glad I worked that idea out of my head, it would have festered there all day long!

 

[John K Jordan]

Following on JKJ's plywood suggestion, how about Spectraply? They also make a product called Dymalux that sound interesting.

For a moment I thought someone was making Dymondwood again (the factory burned down years ago). All I could find with Google was thin pieces of Dymalux intended for knife scales and such, not thick pieces for turning.

I used to use Dymondwood a lot. Almost looks like Spectraply blocks sliced thin at angles, and reassembled/glued.



I've used a lot of Spectraply over the years - I understand it is repeated patterns of dyed birch plywood veneer glued into blocks. It looks especially interesting if the block is first cut an an angle. Big Monk had a bunch at the TAW. Not sure it would be tough enough to withstand ring abuse but I've never made or worn wooden rings.

My Lovely Bride required me to make some stoppers to take on a recent trip. The one on center right is almost too much color for me but some people love that.
Niles hardware.




JKJ

 

[Ron Solfest]

Okay, the uneducated shadetree wood engineer in me has been thinkin'... (Uh oh.)

Laminations. In particular, wrapped laminations of very thin layers, glued together (probably epoxy, or maybe a permanent spray adhesive?).

Likely the strongest lamination will be from a vertical grain orientation, as shown in my first photo below, and explained in this website.

Lumber 101: Vertical Grain vs. Flat Grain | Lumberstore.ca

Welcome to the first post of the Lumber 101 series! This is the start of a small series of educational posts to share some of our knowledge about lumber. Today’s topic is Vertical Grain vs. Flat Grain…

www.lumberstore.ca

Back to drinking straws, a thin layer of vertical grain wood will be just like a singular layer of drinking straws on a tabletop. That layer of wood will be flexible due to the thinness, and strong due to long, uninterrupted fibers.

Enter the hand plane shavings. Shown below are some shavings (boring pine, and too wide for the purpose) from my shop floor. (They are not from a vertical grain cut board, though.) They are close enough to demonstrate how a vertical grain hand plane shaving could be glued upon itself (like a roll of tape) to form a ring. Since the wood fibers would be continuous, by the time the multi-layer lamination is cured, it should actually be very strong compare to a solid piece of wood that is simply drilled.

Thin, wispy shavings would be a pain to work with, and thick shavings may not be flexible enough. I'm guessing, but shavings in the 1/64" to 1/32" zone might be good.

A vertical grain board, 1/4" to maybe 3/8" thick, that has nice, straight face grain, with a board edge cut parallel to the edge, and a finely sharpened hand plane used with great care and moderate speed, should net nice, long, clean curly shavings. At 1/32" thick, you'd need probably 4 (5 or 6?) wraps/laminated layers, and for an average finger size that shaving should probably be a good 12-16" long.

A turned dowel made to the ring size, and then wrapped with waxed or parchment paper, would work to form to glued ring and still be able to release it from the dowel. Might have to clean the paper out of the inside diameter of the ring. Very little to no lathe work involved here, but maybe the final rough ring shape can be lathe mounted for final shaping and finish.

Phew, I'm glad I worked that idea out of my head, it would have festered there all day long!
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There’s actually a commercial company that sells wood and epoxy rings made with circumferential wood wraps held together with epoxy similar to what you discuss. I think I found it on Amazon. I toyed with making some like this but the process (including finishing/polishing) was more time than I wanted to invest.

 

[Chris Lawrence]

If you want to keep all wood rings from breaking make a lamination in 2 or 3 thin pieces of face grain. Alternate each layer 90 degrees so the grain of each layer crosses the other layer.

 

[Richard Coers]

Brittle makes turning tough, it doesn't make it snap in half after you are done unless there were other factors. What moisture was the wood? Most cracking issues are from minute cracks before you turn, or the wood is wet and dries after turning and cracks across the short grain. Heat from sanding will also do that with exotics. Dull sandpaper doesn't help. But you put too much friction during sanding and you dry the surface out more than the middle.

 

[Raif Harik]

@Richard Coers Interesting. So perhaps it was the individual ring that was flawed not the choice of wood. I'll give it another try.
@John K Jordan I will try to do a write up. I'm sure my technique is far from the best, so maybe I'll get some good suggestions.
Some thoughts on the replies. Folks seem pretty skeptical about wood rings. But I've seen them being sold for 3 or 4 hundred. All wood, not laminate. I can post a link if you like.
The ring I mentioned that broke a couple days ago, well, it's still on my finger. Its broken through and through I can open and close it like. But its still holding together. So that kind of speaks to ... something.
I mean, I know there are plenty of people who like, buy nice things and then take really good care of them. e.g. not wearing them into the shop or when mud wrestling etc. I know it sounds improbable but they do exist. And I think they "know" that they should not wear their wood rings in certain circumstances. My brother who inspired me to go down this ring path was like "oh I wouldn't wear it while ... ". Weirdo. But I guess people like that get to have nicer things.

 

[John K Jordan]

I will try to do a write up. I'm sure my technique is far from the best, so maybe I'll get some good suggestions.

I did search for some info on ring-making on a lathe and found some. Most added wood to metal, which I'm not interested in. Some videos of turning rings had some value but were not that useful on holding methods, tools and technique.

Now I want to make some - maybe next week, busy time now. (spent hours working on a friend's chainsaw, chain, and bar today - not the working with wood I intended today!

One question - how do you go about sizing for someone else? Measure a ring that fits them? I see a number of inexpensive measuring tools on amazon.

JKJ

 

[Raif Harik]

@John K Jordan I ordered one of the cone ring sizing mandrel things and it actually came with like a key ring of rings. omg the words don't mean anything any more. Well there were basically a whole bunch of rings, one for each 1/2 ring size. So you could have the person try those on. Then it also had some fabric measuring strip, which I have not used. So you can either slip one of their rings on the mandrel or have them try on the sizing rings for the right fit. I think the latter is best, but if you are thinking of surprising them and must be discreet then do the former.

 

[Rick Moreton]

I made several rings years ago for my wife and me since my wedding ring no longer fit. I used plane shavings glued with CA glue. For the form and sizing I took one of my wife's rings and found a socket wrench that was a little under sized. I wrapped it in blue tape to get it to size and so I wouldn't bond it to the socket.

 

[John K Jordan]

@John K Jordan I ordered one of the cone ring sizing mandrel things and it actually came with like a key ring of rings. omg the words don't mean anything any more. Well there were basically a whole bunch of rings, one for each 1/2 ring size. So you could have the person try those on. Then it also had some fabric measuring strip, which I have not used. So you can either slip one of their rings on the mandrel or have them try on the sizing rings for the right fit. I think the latter is best, but if you are thinking of surprising them and must be discreet then do the former.

Like this? (https://www.amazon.com/Measuring-Mandrel-Measurer-Reusable-Magnified/dp/B0DHX4K6CX)


For a surprise I might try to get a friend to "borrow" one of their rings.

On the subject of rings, have you made Ring Keepers? These are VERY popular and very easy to make. I've made dozens and some beginners have made them after a spindle-turning lesson. My wife keeps one at the sink and another at her jewelry station. I think this idea came from Bob Rosand. The only specification is the top can't be too big! I usually make the top no bigger than 1/2" diameter, a bit narrower towards the bottom.



JKJ

 

[Raif Harik]

While we're in the topic of strange rings, and I'm knee deep in my 3rd bourbon, I'll mention that when I proposed to my to wife on a beach in Nicaragua I had fashioned a ring out of a slice of mother-in-laws-tongue (the plant, I think also called snake plant) so I know a thing or two about ring durability!

 

[Bill Blasic]

Many years ago I purchased from Dave Mueller "The Aggie Turner" (aggieturner.com) stainless steel ring cores and a DVD he made on how to do it.