Anyone have a picture of a Thompson flute less gouge?

[Sam Fleisher]

I've been reading about the Crown skewchigouge and I was wondering how much they look alike? I found an old thread from 2009 where the crown tool was discussed and the Thompson was mentioned but I never found any pics of it.

If it's the one tool away from greatness I figured I might as well put the crown cost towards the Thompson tool.

Thank you oh wise ones.

 

[john lucas]

I don't see any advantage to a fluteless gouge. I played with one. I now use a Thomkins V skew which is similar in that its flat on top but resembles the V scrapers that often come with cheap tool sets. His tool has a slightly rounded area at the bottom of the v. It cuts like a skew but is easier to use. I think that was supposed to be the advantage of a fluteless gouge. If you put an acute grind on it like 35 degrees it cuts very clean but I don't think it is any less likely to catch.

 

[James Seyfried]

I have a 3/8" one. I probably ground the heel off it. I haven't used it a lot but have found it useful when having issues with certain pieces. As a racing mentor has told me, it's always good to have options. I also don't think it is any less likely to catch. I also have a Crown skewchigouge that I don't use because I'd get catches, probably because I don't know how to use it properly.

 

[Sam Fleisher]

I have a 3/8" one. I probably ground the heel off it. I haven't used it a lot but have found it useful when having issues with certain pieces. As a racing mentor has told me, it's always good to have options. I also don't think it is any less likely to catch. I also have a Crown skewchigouge that I don't use because I'd get catches, probably because I don't know how to use it properly.

View attachment 80257View attachment 80258

So the Thompson wouldn't be anymore useful if it looked more like the crown tool then? I was wanting a Thompson version because I like the steel of my regular gouges. My regular gouges are all "v" though maybe it would help if it had more of a point on the tip instead of almost straight across and swept back like a spindle gouge? Although then it might as well be a skewchigouge I guess.

 

[James Seyfried]

So the Thompson wouldn't be anymore useful if it looked more like the crown tool then?

I don't know. I was mistaken, I don't have the Crown tool, I have the Sorby Spindlemaster that is 3/4" and has a rounded tip. That is the other tool I was thinking of. The Thompson tool looks like it might be a different angle than the Crown, but they do look similar.

 

[Kent Reisdorph]

So the Thompson wouldn't be anymore useful if it looked more like the crown tool then? I was wanting a Thompson version because I like the steel of my regular gouges. My regular gouges are all "v" though maybe it would help if it had more of a point on the tip instead of almost straight across and swept back like a spindle gouge? Although then it might as well be a skewchigouge I guess.

If the Crown is M42 cryo, then you can't go wrong. My Crown gouges hold an edge better than my Thompson.

 

[Bill Blasic]

Just so you know the Thompson 10V or 15V (if ever made again) are Cryo treated as that is part of the treatment that makes 10V or 15V what they are. I'm not going to get into a _issing contest but I have owned or tried most every tool or tool steel made and nothing stays sharper longer than The Thompson 10V or 15V steel. There are tool steels that can closely match or get near but nothing better I'm sure. Also they are less expensive!
The fluteless gouge for me is a finishing tool. The Thompson fluteless gouge works either way from bottom to top or top to bottom. You see the edge no matter which direction unlike a gouge you might have turned over and cannot exactly see the cut. It is another tool useful for tricky woods. I seldom use it but when you need it it is very helpful to have.

 

[Brian Gustin]

IMHO it'd take some skill to get familiar with the fluteless gouge - for some reason it works nothing like a typical gouge - I got one based on watching Robo hippy use one through bottom transitions - much like a BOB gouge with a steep angle to the bevel (70 degree or some such) but I could never master it and ended up trying different grinds and experiments with it - Trying to figure out why , if it has an identical grind to my Ellsworth style bowl gouge, why it doesn't cut the same?! You'd think flute shouldn't matter if you could present the edge in the same way , but something escapes me with presentation I suppose so It now just sits parked and gathering dust until I give it another try... maybe one day I'll stumble across a way to use it that works for me....

 

[John Grace]

I have a Thompson fluteless that I purchased on a whim. Don't use it often and I sometimes refer to it as my 'tool of last resort'. I use it when I encounter a certain grain pattern that I simply cannot clean up with any of my other tools. Freshly sharpened and rolled to the correct angle I can finish out squirrely grain and/or clean up persistent tooling marks.

 

[robo hippy]

I did this video a long time ago. I still use the fluteless gouges, mostly for fine finish cuts on the bottoms of bowls. The Sorby Spindle Masters were an attempt by Sorby to recreate an Allan Batty tool, but Allan said, "they got it all wrong"! They are just too thin. I think Cindy Drozda and maybe Stuart Batty have a similar tool which is a smaller fluteless gouge but sharpened to a more acute point, almost like a spindle detail gouge. Can't remember if I got that in this video or not.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suRxCxdMn4k


If I am going to pull off some bulk, my favorite BOB tool is a spindle detail gouge with a ) nose and a 60 to 70 degree bevel.

robo hippy

 

[Webb Willmott]

Robo, do you recommend a 1/2” or 5/8” FG if you were buying just one for bowl use?

 

[Bill Blasic]

Not Robo but if a 1/2" will do a 5/8" is better. More meat the farther off the tool rest.

 

[John Grace]

Not Robo but if a 1/2" will do a 5/8" is better. More meat the farther off the tool rest.

I agree...I sometimes have a problem with my smaller tools 'digging in' just making even more tooling marks. I prefer the 5/8" fluteless for just that reason bearing in mind different turners all have their own individual 'sweet spot' for tooling sizes.

 

[robo hippy]

I do use the 5/8 more. One thing I have never been able to figure out is with bowl gouges. I resisted for a long time, but finally tried a 1/2 inch gouge for the inside finish cuts in my bowls. Geometry is identical, but for reasons unknown, and as yet unexplained, I get better cuts with the half inch gouge. Now, I may have to experiment. Haven't been turning much, I am building a cabinet for my lathe room with 24 drawers in it. This is turning into a chore.... Been doing some rolling pins. Have a bunch of box blanks where I rough turned the tenon and recess, and they are waiting.

Oh, the Drozda/Batty tool, I think is what they call their "Vortex" tool. Not positive about that.

robo hippy

 

[Steve Tiedman]

Just so you know the Thompson 10V or 15V (if ever made again) are Cryo treated as that is part of the treatment that makes 10V or 15V what they are. I'm not going to get into a _issing contest but I have owned or tried most every tool or tool steel made and nothing stays sharper longer than The Thompson 10V or 15V steel. There are tool steels that can closely match or get near but nothing better I'm sure.

Below is a copy/paste summary from Google art. intel. when searching for Knife Steel Nerds info on 10V and 15V. (The author of KSN is a PhD metallurgist.)
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According to Knife Steel Nerds, CPM 15V has higher wear resistance than CPM 10V due to its significantly greater vanadium content, but this comes at the cost of lower toughness. Both steels use a powder metallurgy process to create very hard vanadium carbides, but 15V has a higher volume of these, resulting in its superior wear resistance at the expense of brittleness.

This video explains the relationship between wear resistance and carbide volume in steels like 10V and 15V:
Knife Steel Nerds
YouTube · Jul 14, 2025
CPM 10V vs. CPM 15V

• Wear Resistance:
  CPM 15V offers significantly higher wear resistance and edge retention than CPM 10V because it contains a much larger amount of vanadium, which forms hard carbides.
  
  
• Toughness:
  CPM 15V has lower toughness (is more brittle) than CPM 10V, as high carbide volume generally reduces toughness.
  
  
• Carbide Structure:
  Both are powder metallurgy (PM) steels with a fine carbide structure, but 15V's structure is dominated by a greater volume of hard vanadium carbides, leading to its superior wear properties.
  
  
• Hardness:
  While not directly a measure of edge retention, higher hardness contributes to wear resistance, and 15V can achieve slightly higher hardness due to its increased carbide volume.
  
  
• Applications:
  15V is suited for applications where extreme wear resistance is paramount, such as high-wear tools. 10V offers a balance of toughness and wear resistance, making it a good all-around high-wear steel.

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Regarding cryogenic treatment, the extreme cold assists the full treatment of phase conversion from the red hot steel to the fully hardened (pre-tempered) steel, and it is not used exclusively for any particular steel. It's a real thing, not a marketing gimmick. Learn more here, direct from the good doctor himself.

Dry Ice vs Liquid Nitrogen vs Freezer - How Cold Do You Need for Cryo? - Knife Steel Nerds

Do you really need cryo for optimal heat treating of knives? How cold do you need for the best heat treatment?

knifesteelnerds.com