cedar

[Charlie Knighton]

i am working on a piece of cedar

in the past i have tried to use an oil, the oil just disappeared in a couple of days, it was like the cedar ate it

the cedar piece has some sapwood which i would like to keep as white as possible

i used some water based poly on a piece of english yew, with good results, any chance that it would work in the cedar???????

i do not have a place to spray lacquer

 

[Jack Riley]

If it is Eastern Red Cedar

it has so much oil that I do not add any kind of oil. If you use a sanding sealer it will turn a shade of brown and will remain gummy over the heavy internal oils. After sanding bare wood the oil will evaporate drying into white crystals. I would not use any finish until the oils have stopped crystallizing. To keep the nice red and white color, I use polyurethane adding several coats.

 

[waltben]

After trying once unsuccessfully I was able to use a poly-type oil I got years back from Woodcraft (I suppose wipe-on poly would be pretty much the same) after wiping the cedar down with mineral spirits to remove both the first attempt and then the natural oil. After it dried, I remember the wood looking like it didn't have any oil, but the colors were the same. The piece was a serving tray sort of thing and didn't have any pockets at the surface anywhere. I was told the finish was still good after three years and that was a year or so back.

 

[Joe Greiner]

Cedar seems to have a "drinking problem," or in the vulgar, it sucks. I've had best results with many coats of polyurethane. Where the absorption was still unsatisfactory, I polished it all with EEE to make it more even, then added paste wax and a final buff.

 

[MichaelMouse]

Eastern red is an oily wood. The traditional approach is to seal it with shellac, which involves a semi-polar solvent to disperse/deposit resin to block penetration by the polar oils which might interfere with adhesion of other oil-based finishes.

Eastern white is a bit different.

Resinous woods are also "resin-set" in the kiln process by elevating the temperature and holding it high in the last stages to drive off a lot of the volatiles.

 

[robert davis]

i love red cedar. it can yield beautiful pieces. i wipd deft sanding sealer while on lathe. after remopving. next day spray several coats of satin spray can deft. next day buff with beall system.

 

[Tom Lewis]

I use the Beal buffing system with no finish on cedar. That way the cedar smell remains and there is no danger the cedar oil will harm the finish.

 

[Rusty Smith]

Will the cedar oil contaminate your buffing wheels when not using a finish?

 

[Tom Lewis]

I have used the beal buffing system on cedar for several years with no problem with contamination.

 

[Charlie Knighton]

Tom, i had planned to just buff the second piece, but....

this stuff sure does smell good but....

i think i will wait til after xmas before i a t t e m p t any more cedar

 

[ebrannon]

I use a mixture of shellac and mineral spirits. Once dry, I use the buffing wax on the outside of the bowl and it looks terrific. Deep read colors and lots of character.

Downside to turning Eastern Red Cedar is my entire shop smells like a hamster cage for a few days!

E

 

[Gary Slater]

I use the Beal buffing system with no finish on cedar.

Do you complete the entire Beal process: tripoli, white diamond then wax? Also, are there any precations one needs to take or consider while using the Beal system on cedar?

 

[cwearing]

Watco clear brushing lacquer works just fine. Any oil is going to darken the natural red appearance of the cedar.

 

[Gil Jones]

Hey, Charlie,
After sanding to 600 or so, I just buff-polish the Cedar (Juniper) with white diamond, and sometimes a buff on Carnauba wax. The resins in this wood are, seemingly, not very friendly to most finishes I might otherwise use.
Here is a sample turned a few days ago. The lid is spalted Beach with a Lemon knob. 8.5" L x 5" W x 2" H.

 

[Charlie Knighton]

Gil, that is a great way to show off cedar, the sapwood wings are terrific and the bowl with the heartwood red, and the top .... really good imagination

is it ok if i sort of copy your design??????????

i have never done a wing design so it may be an adventure, but i have room to put a couple more pieces in the burn pile

 

[Gil Jones]

Thanks, Charlie,
You may copy or elaborate as you wish, but it is hardly my design.
I was looking at some woodturning videos on You Tube, and came across a person showing how he makes a winged box out of a piece of flat wood. I had a small (3.5" diameter stock) piece of Cedar given to me by a friend, and it contained a "Y"-crotch. I just cut out the "Y", bored a 2 1/8" dia x 1/2" deep recess for a chuck to expand into, and the rest is as you see it.
Here are the 9 You Tube demo sequences I watched before I started making this piece.
Have fun, but be careful, that propeller could be a "gotcha".
Here are the top and bottom pics (well, they are at the bottom of this post).
Gil
================
The You Tube video is by Bob Ham.
Winged Box

1)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUeByxpbB9M

2)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBDqWHUSy4E&feature=related

3)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDBlshZ4An4&feature=related

4)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2EFq7Pw-5o&NR=1

5)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rTfZb02sYk&feature=related

6)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIj9nsE8_sE&feature=related

7)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nO5J9LOxeAw&feature=related

8)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFgOTZ3uw74&feature=related

9)…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gAutr2Qrr0&feature=related

 

[Charlie Knighton]

thanks for the link to the video, my cedar is in log form, this will take some more thought and care for the setup than i am used to, i definetly do not want to slap a piece between centers and turn up at 3500 rpm, i am not comfortable at that speed

the demonstrator was very good and i liked your piece before i had seen the video, now i really like it, well done

thanks for your help

 

[Gil Jones]

[FONT=&quot]Charlie thanks again, and good luck with yours. I would like to see it when you get around to it. I reckon if you have a bandsaw you could just saw up a couple slabs of 2" to 3" thick flat stock lumber from a 10" long section of the log. Until I bite the bullet on a bandsaw, I might consider using a chainsaw, or just splitting the log section to the size I need.
The fastest RPM I used on this one was 2,300, with the Trend AirShield was firmly in place, and it still sounded like a Piper Cub on takeoff roll. Fingers are still attached.
Gil[/FONT]

 

[Charlie Knighton]

Gil

my bandsaw mainly gets used as odds and end table, bought well used added riser block, and about scared me to death the couple times i have used it...mainly i crosscut with chainsaw and then split to shape with grain ...that said, cedar does not split very well but....in january i will have an oppertunity to see Rudollph Lopez do a rotation @florida woodturning symposium, natural edge wing bowl w/green wood....thanks again

 

[MichaelMouse]

my bandsaw mainly gets used as odds and end table, bought well used added riser block, and about scared me to death the couple times i have used it...

Shame on you. That bandsaw is the key to maintaining your lathe's bearings and your good looks. Trend air shields are not going to stop a lump spinning off at 3K, so you should take care of it yourself. No sense beating the lathe to death by not rounding and even trimming your basic block before mounting. What you don't need should be gone, especially if it interferes with good balance. This works, http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/Bark-up.jpg but it would be better to do this http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/Biggest-Ever.jpg and have some of that unneeded wood out of the way. That much weight differential that far out is tough on the lathe, and if you, for reasons unknown choose to use your spur center instead of other safer options, could be tough on you if you dismount. Some of us don't think it's any great achievement to mount a badly out-of-balance piece on our heavily weighted lathe and beat ourselves and the bearings to death. We use our bandsaw instead. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/Trim-for-balance-1.jpg

NO WAY would I turn at 3K, 680 is fine for the likes of me. It's also the max recommended by my chuck manufacturer, oddly enough. I remember those red lines on the side of propeller aircraft. The ones that said "propeller disintegration zone". So slow is good enough if you cut the wood. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/ContactSheet-Fire2.jpg Not even too bad a surface "from the gouge" if you look at 1341 and 1344 here. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/HeartBirch.jpg

 

[Charlie Knighton]

mm,

i probably should shape my blanks a little better, your point on savings your bearings is a good one
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d1...ne/Bark-up.jpg

i also like to use my tailstock pulled up as much as possible

i see you are still using your roughing gouge on bowls, your tool control has to be exact, that scares me as much as my bandsaw, those are very nice bowls, cherry??

 

[Joe Greiner]

heavily weighted lathe - not

This is one of the advantages of NOT buying your last lathe first. It forces you to form good habits, such as balancing the lump before serious turning. And the bandsaw cuts don't have to perfectly round; initial turning cuts will have some thump, thump, thump anyway, so 8 or 16 sides by bandsaw or chain saw can be adequate. The waste pieces are easier to dispose of, versus copious shavings, or they can be saved foe smaller future elements.

If the workpiece is still unbalanced, best found by letting it drift on the lathe, I reduce it further with a Lancelot in a right-angle grinder. To reduce motion, I use a couple wedges between the workpiece and the lathe bed. This is a little better than using the lathe's locking devices, because it's applied directly at the point of need.

And I don't have enough room for a Mustard Monster, yet.