Got the Thompson bottom feeder. Very hard to use

[Sam Beagle]

what am I missing. Plus. Does anyone know the Wolverine setup for sharpening it.

Lastly. I tried making a bottom feeder from an older sorby gouge. I don’t know what flute it was. But no matter what I did, I couldn’t make it work.

 

[hockenbery]

The gouge cutting edge must have a continuous convex shape wing to wing. Any dips may prevent it from working.

Here is how to get started
You will want to start the cut a little way up on the side wall assuming you have a continuous curve fro rim to bottom center.
Get the tool rest a close as you can.
point the flute to 3 o’clock 12 is straight up.
Let the heel of the bevel lightly rub the wood. Pushing the tool handle forward will lever the bevel,onto the wood using the heel as a fulcrum. As you do this slowly move the toll edge forward it should start cutting.
Continue the cut toward bottom center with the bevel floating over where you just cut.

If the tool doesn’t cut slide it backward a little with the bevel in light contact. Start forward again pushing the handle forward a lilt more than the last time. As soon as the tools starts cuttin the bevel,is riding.

Once you start getting the feel for picking up the cut with the bevel riding,you will have it.
Position the tool rest so you can cut the bottom 1/3 of the bowl pick it tje cut an go to bottom center. Light cuts.
The middle - slow down the wood is not coming last tool as fast the last little shaving in the middle will make a come as it peels off. Try to catch that littl,come in the flute of the gouge. This will slow youncut more and prevent digging a hole.

 

[Sam Beagle]

Thank you. I will give that a go. Any thoughts on sharpening the gouge.

 

[john lucas]

I think with a bottom feeder you are only using the nose. It does need to blend into the wings smoothly so if you rotate slightly off the nose the cut won't change.
I prefer to use a Hunter #4 or #5 as a bottom feeder. They have an 82 degree outside bevel so you can cut the bottom of very steep sided bowls.

 

[John Spitters]

A “U” shaped flute works best as a bottom feeder, not sure of the angle I have ground on mine but it’s probably around 70, 75 degree.

 

[Owen Lowe]

what am I missing.

I guess I’m missing something too… Why have Thompson’s name in the subject when you stated you modified a Sorby gouge? It certainly looks like click-bait.

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

I guess I’m missing something too… Why have Thompson’s name in the subject when you stated you modified a Sorby gouge? It certainly looks like click-bait.

Looks like he has the bottom feeder, and he also tried to make one with a Sorby one. I can see somebody having a bit of trouble using the bottom feeder if nobody gives you some pointers. Also, I have a micro bevel on mine. And, to finish a round bottom calabash, I use 3 different angles, 60, 70 and 80. I don't have to use a protractor anymore, I go by eye, and grind by hand... I can leave a glossy finish with my 3/4 in bottom feeder Thompson gouge, one of my favorite tools.

 

[Donovan Bailey]

Looks like he has the bottom feeder, and he also tried to make one with a Sorby one. I can see somebody having a bit of trouble using the bottom feeder if nobody gives you some pointers. Also, I have a micro bevel on mine. And, to finish a round bottom calabash, I use 3 different angles, 60, 70 and 80. I don't have to use a protractor anymore, I go by eye, and grind by hand... I can leave a glossy finish with my 3/4 in bottom feeder Thompson gouge, one of my favorite tools.

I most certainly agree with you, Emiliano. It is not "just another gouge" in that there is a little learning curve to using it to produce that finish on the bottom that just can't be beat. As a side note...highly recommend that you mention the term "bottom feeder" to Mr. Clewes whenever you next see him. He is not a fan of the term and he goes into a little rant about certain people coming up with goofy names for our tools. You will enjoy the discussion.

 

[Bill Blasic]

I don't know why Jimmy would have an issue with "bottom feeder" after all Mate 1 and 2 and Mega Mate are also just made up names The bottom feeder to me is a big U shaped tool with a blunt grind made for the transition cut towards the bottom of the bowl and I too use a micro bevel like Emiliano. I mainly use it on bigger bowls and on smaller ones I use a 3/8 U gouge with a blunt grind (about 80 degrees).

 

[robo hippy]

BOB tools as I call them (bottom of bowl) because I thought some one had a 'signature' bottom feeder as a name, are a specialized tool for getting through the transition and across the bottom of the bowl. There are many variations. They range from bevel angles of 60 to 80 degrees, and most have a very slight sweep to the nose profile, kind of ) shaped. I always do mine on a platform, but then I do every thing on a platform... Do grind away at least half of the heel on the bevel to allow it to move through the concave shape with ease and not leave bruises on the wood. I do keep mine rolled all the way over on the side, flutes at 75 to 90 degrees, and handle slightly dropped. Very light touch: "The bevel should rub the wood, but the wood should not know it." I have a number of different ones, but one of my favorites is Doug's fluteless gouge, and a couple of shallow fluted detail/spindle gouges with the ) nose profile. Also one old Craft Supplies 1/2 inch gouge with pretty much a half round flute shape...

BOB tools at about :31 minutes....

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rZ6iR3bbEk


robo hippy

 

[Donovan Bailey]

BOB tools as I call them (bottom of bowl) because I thought some one had a 'signature' bottom feeder as a name, are a specialized tool for getting through the transition and across the bottom of the bowl. There are many variations. They range from bevel angles of 60 to 80 degrees, and most have a very slight sweep to the nose profile, kind of ) shaped. I always do mine on a platform, but then I do every thing on a platform... Do grind away at least half of the heel on the bevel to allow it to move through the concave shape with ease and not leave bruises on the wood. I do keep mine rolled all the way over on the side, flutes at 75 to 90 degrees, and handle slightly dropped. Very light touch: "The bevel should rub the wood, but the wood should not know it." I have a number of different ones, but one of my favorites is Doug's fluteless gouge, and a couple of shallow fluted detail/spindle gouges with the ) nose profile. Also one old Craft Supplies 1/2 inch gouge with pretty much a half round flute shape...

robo hippy

I watched your great video on the fluteless gouge...and that is my next tool procurement. I think that the concept looks interesting and I look forward to giving it a go.

 

[john lucas]

The Hunter 4 has an 82 degree outside bevel but has a highly polished 60 degree inside bevel. It leaves a spectacular finish on the bottom.of bowls and boxes. Instill.have a bottom feeder blew gouge but gave t used it I years.

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

The Hunter 4 has an 82 degree outside bevel but has a highly polished 60 degree inside bevel. It leaves a spectacular finish on the bottom.of bowls and boxes. Instill.have a bottom feeder blew gouge but gave t used it I years.

John, you might want to edit the last sentence, not sure what you are saying... Are you typing on a cell phone? You should have autocorrect unless you have a flip phone...

 

[Mike Brazeau]

I would just use the Wolverine to grind. No need to use the Varigrind.

 

[john lucas]

John, you might want to edit the last sentence, not sure what you are saying... Are you typing on a cell phone? You should have autocorrect unless you have a flip phone...

Mine does really weird auto correct. I wanted to say I havent used my bottom bowl gouge in years.

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

I

Mine does really weird auto correct. I wanted to say I havent used my bottom bowl gouge in years.

I also have a Spanish keyboard on my phone, my autocorrect gets really confused too! Good luck moving your shop!!

 

[Odie]

what am I missing. Plus. Does anyone know the Wolverine setup for sharpening it.

Lastly. I tried making a bottom feeder from an older sorby gouge. I don’t know what flute it was. But no matter what I did, I couldn’t make it work.

I modified a gouge to the Mahoney bottom feeder for a time. I'm not using it much anymore, because I also had trouble with it's handling characteristics. I've returned to using a standard grind gouge but using the tip from left to right in a push cut for general shaping. For cleaning up, reverse the direction to a drag, or pull cut. I'm using this for smoothing the surface on the bottom of the bowl interior, just prior to sanding......with anything, there are multiple ways of accomplishing an acceptable surface, but takes some practice to perfect your techniques. There's probably very few of us turners who can get refined results the first time and every time......takes practice!

-----odie-----

 

[john lucas]

Here is my Hunter #4 video that shows how I cut box interiors. In this case I am cutting from the center out but if you are doing bow bottoms you can cut from the left to the right, just tilt the cutter the other direction. You can see how straight out the tool is. If you do dog bowl shapes you can use the tool just like I show shear scraping the corner. The shear scrape with the Hunter cutters you have to push the handle out away from the wall a few degrees. This moves the scrape from 6 oclock to 7 or 8 so the wood crosses the tip at an angle. It cuts cleaner this way, very much like a skew on it's side. I guess I really need to do a bottom feeder video.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfp2kvhH6Mo&t=393s

 

[Donovan Bailey]

Here is my Hunter #4 video that shows how I cut box interiors. In this case I am cutting from the center out but if you are doing bow bottoms you can cut from the left to the right, just tilt the cutter the other direction. You can see how straight out the tool is. If you do dog bowl shapes you can use the tool just like I show shear scraping the corner. The shear scrape with the Hunter cutters you have to push the handle out away from the wall a few degrees. This moves the scrape from 6 oclock to 7 or 8 so the wood crosses the tip at an angle. It cuts cleaner this way, very much like a skew on it's side. I guess I really need to do a bottom feeder video.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfp2kvhH6Mo&t=393s

Nice video that is very useful, John. Thanks for posting it. I see where it costs $20 for a replacement cutter...and there is no way to sharpen a cutter?

 

[john lucas]

There isn't any way to sharpen the cutters. I tried. However they last a very long time. I use the one on the cutter in that video for 2 years. Not every bowl but just about every box and when new tuners came over I would show them the tool and how to use it so it did get a fair amount of use. Divide that $20 by 12 and you get $1.60 a month. Not a bad investment even if you only got 6 months out of it. I've taught 5 classes using my Hercules, Viceroy and Clewes tools and have yet to replace a cutter on any of them.

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

Here is my Hunter #4 video that shows how I cut box interiors. In this case I am cutting from the center out but if you are doing bow bottoms you can cut from the left to the right, just tilt the cutter the other direction. You can see how straight out the tool is. If you do dog bowl shapes you can use the tool just like I show shear scraping the corner. The shear scrape with the Hunter cutters you have to push the handle out away from the wall a few degrees. This moves the scrape from 6 oclock to 7 or 8 so the wood crosses the tip at an angle. It cuts cleaner this way, very much like a skew on it's side. I guess I really need to do a bottom feeder video.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfp2kvhH6Mo&t=393s

I will always be grateful to you for having converted me to a "carbide guy" Before you sending me the Hunter #4, I was very skeptical about them. I definitely believe now that carbide tools, specifically the Hunter Tools, have a place in a woodturners arsenal. I use mine a lot in my box making. I just a got another set of the #1 set, with a small Thomson handle now. The other set I epoxied them on some nice curly Citridora Eucalyptus handles. The advantage with a Thomson handle is that I can bring them in for less vibration on a small box, or I can extend them a little to reach deeper. I will be using them in Raleigh, for my demos. Aloha John!

 

[Sam Beagle]

I bought a Thompson bottom feeder. It’s difficult to use. I also tried making one out of an older Sorby. This was previously. click bait? I’m asking a question

 

[Dean Center]

John Lucas, I use my Hunter with great enthusiasm and success on boxes. I've tried using it like a gouge on bowl insides, and haven't gotten good results. It's been a while since I have tried, but I remember it as being grabby, maybe self-feeding, maybe wanting to steer itself into the bowl wall. Have you discovered any tricks or cautions when doing this? Thanks.

 

[john lucas]

Dean you just have to keep the angle of the cutter about 45 degrees or so, maybe even steeper. Control the cut from the end of the handle. the bevel is very short and it's easy to move the handle too far and come off the bevel which of course leads to it being catchy. going down the sides toward the middle is fairly easy but when you get to the flatter section of the bottom it is really easy to swing the handle to far. Coming across the bottom you are almost moving the handle the same speed as the cutter.

 

[Dean Center]

Thanks, John. Exactly what I need.

 

[robo hippy]

John, with the carbide cutters, has any one tried the honing pastes to touch them up rather than the diamond plates? I had a spoon carving friend, now doing copy right work, and he had a honing stick with 4 different colors/grits of pastes on it. He complained about a burr on one of his carving chisels that I couldn't feel, even with my non guitar fingers. Not sure if the honing pastes would be enough to touch up the new carbides or not...

Oh yea, when you are saying keeping it at 45 degrees, I assume you are meaning the shear angle? I do consider 45 degrees to be the kind of 'standard' angle, but I generally go for 60 to 70 degrees for a finer cut, but with my BOB tools, and not the cutter...

robo hippy

 

[john lucas]

I tried all sorts of polishing and honing compounds. Obviously didn't find the right ones to succeed.
As far as the angle of the Hunter cutter I say 45 because that's a good starting point. Depending on where and how I'm cutting that angle goes from 45 to 90.

 

[John Torchick]

Interesting thread and discussion. Thanks to all who contributed.

 

[Donovan Bailey]

what am I missing. Plus. Does anyone know the Wolverine setup for sharpening it.

Lastly. I tried making a bottom feeder from an older sorby gouge. I don’t know what flute it was. But no matter what I did, I couldn’t make it work.

Sam: Mike Peace has a pretty danged good video on the use of a bottom-of-the-bowl gouge...to include how to sharpen one.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5lKqfog5K4