• It's time to cast your vote in the April 2025 Turning Challenge. (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Steve Bonny for "A Book Holds What Time Lets Go" being selected as Turning of the Week for 28 April, 2025 (click here for details)
  • Welcome new registering member. Your username must be your real First and Last name (for example: John Doe). "Screen names" and "handles" are not allowed and your registration will be deleted if you don't use your real name. Also, do not use all caps nor all lower case.

Grinder angle setup / Raptor setup tools

Mark Hepburn

Mark Hepburn

Artist & Chef
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
Messages
1,622
Likes
580
Location
Houma, Louisiana
I have the Wolverine / Varigrind jig set up like many here. I've been using it for a while but to be honest, I haven't been disciplined in my approach and repeat-ability has been an issue.

So I'm considering these Raptor set up tools on CSUSA's site. But I have a couple of questions if anyone can help.

rap_set_up_too-3.jpg

I read on SC forum that the distance from the arbor center of the grinder to the base of the jig must be 6 1/2" or these won't work. If this is so, then I'm forever tied to that particular dimension and I don't know if that will have any unintended consequences.

Does anyone have any experience with using these on a regular basis and are there any things I should consider? Or are there any alternatives that work consistently and easily?

Thanks!
 
Mark Hepburn said:
I read on SC forum that the distance from the arbor center of the grinder to the base of the jig must be 6 1/2" or these won't work. If this is so, then I'm forever tied to that particular dimension and I don't know if that will have any unintended consequences.
Click to expand...

I can't see where that dimension matters. If you have your Wolverine set up correctly according to the Oneway instructions then all that the Raptor is doing is setting the Wolverine V pocket distance from the wheel surface to give you a particular nose angle. When the pocket is set to the right distance according to the Raptor then nothing else matters unless you are hitting the wheel guard
 
John,as always, it was a very helpful video. Thank you.

I thought I had watched all of yours but hadn't seen this one. I'm going to spend some time in the shop tomorrow doing the jigs and the insert block. Great ideas.

Only one problem: I don't have an eye to put on my Ellsworth/varigrind jig. :D
 
Bill Boehme said:
I can't see where that dimension matters. If you have your Wolverine set up correctly according to the Oneway instructions then all that the Raptor is doing is setting the Wolverine V pocket distance from the wheel surface to give you a particular nose angle. When the pocket is set to the right distance according to the Raptor then nothing else matters unless you are hitting the wheel guard.

I don't have the Raptor jigs, but I think they are very good tools. Jigs like John shows have been around long before the Raptor jigs and if so inclined you could save a few bucks by rolling your own.
Click to expand...

I'm going to roll my own tomorrow.

Ive been considering what you said and it seems logical to me. Otherwise, now that I'm reading your post, there would be a ridiculously high retrace on the product.
 
Toss the Raptor jigs far into the darkness of the night and go with 1' PVC pipe to set the V-arm extension distance. See attached photos. Cut PVC pipe to length (trial and error) that sets the V-arm to the proper distance for required grind. Works great with CBN (or similar) grinding wheels because they never change diameter. With a constant diameter grinding wheel and extension of V-arm set by PVC pipe, two of three variables required to reproduce your favorite grind are set. The only remaining variable is the angle of the leg on the Oneway (or equal) vari-grind jig. I have my vari-grind leg more/less permanently set. So, when I want to change grind, all I have to do is pull out the proper PVC pipe, set the V-arm and grind away. - John

PS - Not the originator of this idea. Picked it up on some woodturning forum/website. - J
DSC_0005.JPG DSC_0006.JPG
 
John,

With the tube cut to length, I can do as John Lucas shows in his video and fix the varigrind and the third variable is solved. Thank you!
 
John King said:
Toss the Raptor jigs far into the darkness of the night and go with 1' PVC pipe to set the V-arm extension distance. See attached photos. Cut PVC pipe to length (trial and error) that sets the V-arm to the proper distance for required grind. Works great with CBN (or similar) grinding wheels because they never change diameter. With a constant diameter grinding wheel and extension of V-arm set by PVC pipe, two of three variables required to reproduce your favorite grind are set. The only remaining variable is the angle of the leg on the Oneway (or equal) vari-grind jig. I have my vari-grind leg more/less permanently set. So, when I want to change grind, all I have to do is pull out the proper PVC pipe, set the V-arm and grind away. - John

PS - Not the originator of this idea. Picked it up on some woodturning forum/website. - J
View attachment 21005 View attachment 21006
Click to expand...

That's a great idea, John. I'd never thought of it, and never seen it until a couple days ago in the "show us your shop" thead.

I was planning to do the same for several angles, with the addition of ripping just enough out of the pipe or conduit to slip over the top.

The other trick I use for identical lengths on both sides of the grinder is an old chainsaw file (could be a dowel or whatever else) cut to length, then place the file in the between the v arm and the wheel. I use that for grinding with dueling CBN wheels, 350 or 600 on one side and 1000 on the other.
 
There is another method of matching a current existing gouge grind to the wheel that works perfectly every time. This works for both the vari-grind jig/v-arm, and the standard (traditional) grind, using only the V-arm. Those using cbn wheels, in conjunction with a vari-grind (or Ellsworth jig) can rely on settings never changing (as long as the extension in the vari-grind jig remains a constant).......however, those who are using matrix wheels and standard grind, need a method of matching an existing grind to the wheel, because the length of the tool and the diameter of the wheel will change.

By looking at how the bevel matches the wheel surface from the side, it's a snap to adjust the v-arm perfectly, so the bevel matches the wheel surface. (If you want a longer, or shorter bevel, this can easily be done by adjusting the length of the v-arm incrementally.)

For seeing how the existing bevel matches the wheel more clearly, a piece of white paper can be attached to a short stick that pivots out of the way, on a magnet.

Mark......It appears as though you've already decided on the method you want to use, and by posting this, I'm only giving an alternative method in this thread.....for general thought on the subject. Hope you don't mind.

IMG_0513.JPG IMG_0514.JPG IMG_0515.JPG
 
Last edited:
odie said:
There is another method of matching a current existing gouge grind to the wheel that works perfectly every time. This works for both the vari-grind jig/v-arm, and the standard (traditional) grind, using only the V-arm. Those using cbn wheels, in conjunction with a vari-grind (or Ellsworth jig) can rely on settings never changing (as long as the extension in the vari-grind jig remains a constant).......however, those who are using matrix wheels and standard grind, need a method of matching an existing grind to the wheel, because the length of the tool and the diameter of the wheel will change.

By looking at how the bevel matches the wheel surface from the side, it's a snap to adjust the v-arm perfectly, so the bevel matches the wheel surface. (If you want a longer, or shorter bevel, this can easily be done by adjusting the length of the v-arm incrementally.)

For seeing how the existing bevel matches the wheel more clearly, a piece of white paper can be attached to a short stick that pivots out of the way, on a magnet.

Mark......It appears as though you've already decided on the method you want to use, and by posting this, I'm only giving an alternative method in this thread.....for general thought on the subject. Hope you don't mind.

View attachment 21007 View attachment 21008 View attachment 21009
Click to expand...

Odie, you forgot one thing. Even though the CBN wheel diameter doesn't change, the tool is getting shorter each time it is sharpened.
 
What I don't like about the PVC is if you need to vary the V arm distance for different tools. It obviously works well but my system works because you can make a jig for any grind. For example I use different angles on my spindle gouges but sharpen them with the wolverine jig. I have different wooden jigs to set the V arm for them and it's much quicker than the PVC.
I now have a CBN wheel and have my V arm locked at the Bowl gouge distance. For the Spindle gouges I simply drop a short V block into the V arm. I put my Wolverine jig in front of that. That moves the tool forward and sharpens it at a steeper angle. I have one for my spindle gouge and one for another gouge that I sharpen inbetween my standard bowl gouge grind and spindle gouge grind.
I should give credit to Mike Darlow in his book he shows a jig that uses 3 points of reference to place the V arm. It is a very good jig but kind of complicated to build. After I built one I came up with the wooden jigs. Then many years later the Raptors came out. don't know where they got the idea, possibly from Mike Darlow's books as well.
 
John,

I have the PVC cut and in use but only for my Ellsworth grind gouges. Since I added the 2nd grinder they're now set up so that one is for platform use and the other has two wolverine arms. That grinder has a 180 and a 600 wheel on it, and what I had hoped for is to be able to transfer from one wheel to the other and just lightly finish the gouges with the 600 wheel.

In practice, it isn't exact enough (this is an implementation / precision issue). Using the jigs in your video I can get the correct settings with more ease. I was going to make them last night but time got away from me. Gonna do them tonight. So if I may, another question or two?

What is the fixed angle at which you set your varigrind? Do you only use that one or do you have multiples? Do you do any Ellsworth grinds with it or do you use his jig (which is what I use)?

By the way, it sounds like you took Mike Darlow's idea and improved on it. That's a new idea so I'm going to give you the credit :-)
 
odie said:
There is another method of matching a current existing gouge grind to the wheel that works perfectly every time..

Mark......It appears as though you've already decided on the method you want to use, and by posting this, I'm only giving an alternative method in this thread.....for general thought on the subject. Hope you don't mind.

View attachment 21007 View attachment 21008 View attachment 21009
Click to expand...

Hey Odie, of course I don't. I appreciate another viewpoint that helps me to learn something new. Frankly, the whole issue of sharpening gouges, and the geometry around it, escapes me a bit. Intuitively I understand that the angles will change as a tool is rotated around a different axis relative to the face of the wheel, but processing these relationships so that they translate to useful data for me is a struggle.

So I'm happy to be a trained monkey, using tools that make it short work and add repeatability.
 
Zach LaPerriere said:
The other trick I use for identical lengths on both sides of the grinder is an old chainsaw file (could be a dowel or whatever else) cut to length, then place the file in the between the v arm and the wheel. I use that for grinding with dueling CBN wheels, 350 or 600 on one side and 1000 on the other.
Click to expand...

Love that; dueling CBN wheels. :-)
 
Bill Boehme said:
Odie, you forgot one thing. Even though the CBN wheel diameter doesn't change, the tool is getting shorter each time it is sharpened.
Click to expand...

Read again, Bill......that's what I said! :D

ko
 
If you sharpen using the Wolverine jig it doesn't matter if the tool gets shorter as long as you extend it the same amount from the jig each time. Mark I tried using a straight stick between the V arm and the wheel. It is just to easy to not get it the exact same distance. I found the 3 point reference to be more exact. It also works well great for setting the Oneway grinding table. Just cut a flat on the bottom instead of the point that goes into the V arm. You set the flat on the grinder tool rest and then adjust it until the 2 points touch the grinding wheel. That's really handy for things like hand sharpening the Stewart Batty grind or hand sharpening skews.
Mark I never change my Wolverine jig. I used to. I went through a spell where I was trying to learn what the different angles do to the grind. I finally decided it was a waste of time. I drilled my jig so I can place a 1/8" drill in the holes and get it back to the exact setting. Sometimes students who are using my jig change things, which is fine because now I can get it back to my position. I could not find the photo of my jig. I have the arm set so the top of the bar is exactly centered on the 3rd notch from the bottom.
 
john lucas said:
If you sharpen using the Wolverine jig it doesn't matter if the tool gets shorter as long as you extend it the same amount from the jig each time. Mark I tried using a straight stick between the V arm and the wheel. It is just to easy to not get it the exact same distance. I found the 3 point reference to be more exact. It also works well great for setting the Oneway grinding table. Just cut a flat on the bottom instead of the point that goes into the V arm. You set the flat on the grinder tool rest and then adjust it until the 2 points touch the grinding wheel. That's really handy for things like hand sharpening the Stewart Batty grind or hand sharpening skews.
Mark I never change my Wolverine jig. I used to. I went through a spell where I was trying to learn what the different angles do to the grind. I finally decided it was a waste of time. I drilled my jig so I can place a 1/8" drill in the holes and get it back to the exact setting. Sometimes students who are using my jig change things, which is fine because now I can get it back to my position. I could not find the photo of my jig. I have the arm set so the top of the bar is exactly centered on the 3rd notch from the bottom.
Click to expand...


Thanks John. I'm going to use the notch setting as you indicate as my reference. And, got a lot of templates to cut tonight. Looking forward to it too.

Thanks everyone for your help. This forum has given me more education (and enjoyment) than I could possibly have imagined over the past couple of years.
 
Once again, I'm not keeping up, so am answering late, but my suggestion is to skip the Raptor set-up gizmos. I had a set, they did not work for my grinder for the very reason that it was too high above the base (necessitated by the shields interfering with the Wolverine base unless it was raised higher). When I went to sell them, I looked at reviews, and most seasoned WWers did not feel they were needed or worth the cost. (However, I did make outlines on poster-board before I shipped them.:D) I am super-happy with my SB Tools set-up gauges. I think they run about $35 apiece online. If Stuart is coming to your area, he might have them for less.
 
Bill Boehme said:
Oops. I guess I was thinking that you weren't using a jig in the V arm of the Wolverine.
Click to expand...

Actually, I seldom use the vari-grind jig anymore, and my wording is more in tune with how I do things......but, I did use the vari-grind jig extensively for over 20 years. Sorry, I know that, even though I try to be as specific and clearly word my posts as I can, I can be a little confusing at times.......I'm working on that! :oops:

I guess you probably know the story about why I have almost completely abandoned the vari-grind jig........ I sort of consider myself the "black sheep" of the AAW forums, since I do so many things that are directly contradictory to the rest of the herd! For me, it's all about results, and not conforming to a specific method one uses to achieve them........;)
IMG_0433copy.JPG
 
Last edited:
Marc, I pretty much follow Dave Schweitzer's instructions for use of the Verigrind and Wolverine stuff, and my gouges are very consistently ground. I have marks on the Verigrind holder for where the leg is set for both bowl gouges and spindle gouges. I use a dowel of a specific length to set the V-pocket from the wheel (actually, from the socket for the V-pocket -- with a CBN wheel, I don't need to measure to the wheel but once). I have a wood block with a hole in it, the depth of the "stick-out" I use for the gouge (in my case, 1-7/8"). As long as the stick-out and the pocket-to-wheel distance are consistent, and the jig leg is set properly, the grind is consistent.

Of course, I don't use much of a variety of grinds like the advanced users here do, but certainly could with this approach. One can of worms I've yet to open here on the forum is the fact that, if you watch different videos of sharpening instructions, you'll find differing opinions on what the pocket distance affects and what the leg-setting affects. Dave's statement on his videos and in person is that the grind of the tool's nose and a very small area on either side of the nose is set by the leg position, and the pocket distance affects the side grind. Given his experience as a machinist and his rather dazzling spatial abilities, I've bought his version.

His videos, best to watch in order -- the 2nd one assumes you know what's in the first. These and a bit of time in his shop turned my sharpening life around!:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxdLXsFl01s

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdF9mmJtuvU


D-way Tools

[OK, I didn't know that putting those links in would embed the videos. Too much like Facebook, LOL!]
 
john lucas said:
If your a member of the AAW your not a black sheep. You just do things differently. We try to learn from each other.
Click to expand...

I agree. Each of us does things a little differently. That's why you see such a diversity of opinions when a question is asked about almost anything.. When it comes to sharpening. I'm more "different" than Odie since I am a Tormek sharpener for 99% of my woodturning tools.

BTW, Odie, a large gathering of sheep is a "flock". :D
 
odie said:
.... I sort of consider myself the "black sheep" of the AAW forums, since I do so many things that are directly contradictory to the rest of the herd! For me, it's all about results, and not conforming to a specific method one uses to achieve them........;)
Click to expand...
We all have different experiences and sharing is what it's all about.
 
John King said:
Toss the Raptor jigs far into the darkness of the night and go with 1' PVC pipe to set the V-arm extension distance. See attached photos. Cut PVC pipe to length (trial and error) that sets the V-arm to the proper distance for required grind. Works great with CBN (or similar) grinding wheels because they never change diameter. With a constant diameter grinding wheel and extension of V-arm set by PVC pipe, two of three variables required to reproduce your favorite grind are set. The only remaining variable is the angle of the leg on the Oneway (or equal) vari-grind jig. I have my vari-grind leg more/less permanently set. So, when I want to change grind, all I have to do is pull out the proper PVC pipe, set the V-arm and grind away. - John

PS - Not the originator of this idea. Picked it up on some woodturning forum/website. - J
View attachment 21005 View attachment 21006
Click to expand...


I too use pieces of ¾-inch or 1-inch PVC tubing to gauge the V-arm position when using the vari-grind jig. However, I slot the tubing length-wise so it will drop down over the arm rather than having to be threaded over the arm. If one uses a fixed arm angle setting, and a fixed value of gouge protrusion from the jig, then V-arm setting uniquely determines the nose angle that is achieved whether it is a spindle gouge, a detail gouge or a bowl gouge. I mainly use four nose angles and require only four pieces of tubing. However, if I should decide to add a fifth angle, it would take only a couple of minutes to cut and slot another piece of PVC.

To make life easier, when I set up my V-arms, I set one arm as specified in the instructions and then tweeked the position of the second arm so that a given piece of PVC yielded the same nose angle for both wheels. Otherwise, I would have had to make a separate set of gauges for the two wheels.
 
Dennis J Gooding said:
I too use pieces of ¾-inch or 1-inch PVC tubing to gauge the V-arm position when using the vari-grind jig. However, I slot the tubing length-wise so it will drop down over the arm rather than having to be threaded over the arm. If one uses a fixed arm angle setting, and a fixed value of gouge protrusion from the jig, then V-arm setting uniquely determines the nose angle that is achieved whether it is a spindle gouge, a detail gouge or a bowl gouge. I mainly use four nose angles and require only four pieces of tubing. However, if I should decide to add a fifth angle, it would take only a couple of minutes to cut and slot another piece of PVC.

To make life easier, when I set up my V-arms, I set one arm as specified in the instructions and then tweeked the position of the second arm so that a given piece of PVC yielded the same nose angle for both wheels. Otherwise, I would have had to make a separate set of gauges for the two wheels.
Click to expand...

Just like Dennis, I have used lengths of PVC tubing (whatever ID I have available) and/or wood dowels to set the arm of the Wolverine jig. However, I don't slot the tubing. I just put one end IN the pocket and slide the arm forward until the other end butts up against the jig where the sliding arm enters and then lock the arm. Quick & simple and any size ID tubing/dowel can be used.
And being the lazy guy that I am…..about 10 years ago I bought a second Vari-Grind jig, so I now have one permanently set for bowl gouges and the second set for spindle gouges…..therefore, using the same arm setting for both. :)
 
Jamie Straw said:
Marc, I pretty much follow Dave Schweitzer's instructions for use of the Verigrind and Wolverine stuff, and my gouges are very consistently ground. I have marks on the Verigrind holder for where the leg is set for both bowl gouges and spindle gouges. I use a dowel of a specific length to set the V-pocket from the wheel (actually, from the socket for the V-pocket -- with a CBN wheel, I don't need to measure to the wheel but once). I have a wood block with a hole in it, the depth of the "stick-out" I use for the gouge (in my case, 1-7/8"). As long as the stick-out and the pocket-to-wheel distance are consistent, and the jig leg is set properly, the grind is consistent.


His videos, best to watch in order -- the 2nd one assumes you know what's in the first. These and a bit of time in his shop turned my sharpening life around!:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxdLXsFl01s

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XdF9mmJtuvU


D-way Tools

Jamie, thanks for your post and the videos. I hadn't watched them yet but will tonight. I actually bought my first set of CBN wheels from Dave and we ended up in a conversation that was very helpful for me. Really good guy, he is.
Click to expand...
 
I've gone to sharpening all my bowl gouges with the 180 grit CBN and have different angles ground on several gouges. I find the Raptors 3-point contacts make it a fast, easy, repeatable and very accurate for changing the V-arm length. Yes, you can make your own and if that's what one wants to do, go right ahead.

I used Robo's rest at 45 degree setting to get a 41.5 degree angle for my so called 40/40 grind and use the 75 degree setting for the bottom feeders.

In some ways I'd like to have 2- 180 grit wheels but I do prefer the burr from the 80 grit wheel for my hollowing scrapers.
 

Attachments

  • Gouges.jpg
    Gouges.jpg
    343.4 KB · Views: 30
John King said:
Toss the Raptor jigs far into the darkness of the night and go with 1' PVC pipe to set the V-arm extension distance. See attached photos. Cut PVC pipe to length (trial and error) that sets the V-arm to the proper distance for required grind. Works great with CBN (or similar) grinding wheels because they never change diameter. With a constant diameter grinding wheel and extension of V-arm set by PVC pipe, two of three variables required to reproduce your favorite grind are set. The only remaining variable is the angle of the leg on the Oneway (or equal) vari-grind jig. I have my vari-grind leg more/less permanently set. So, when I want to change grind, all I have to do is pull out the proper PVC pipe, set the V-arm and grind away. - John

PS - Not the originator of this idea. Picked it up on some woodturning forum/website. - J
View attachment 21005 View attachment 21006
Click to expand...
that's genius
 
I agree with the almost unanimous opinion that there are better options than the Raptor tool. I use the PVC gauge method and because I use a fixed arm angle for the jig and a single gouge protrusion value, I only need one PVC gauge for each nose angle that in my arsenal, regardless of whether it is a spindle gouge, detail gouge or bowl gouge. A further problem with the Raptor tool is that it gives the correct nose angle only if the jig arm angle is set to 23 degrees. In my opinion, this much too small an angle to achieve a satisfactory sharp long wing on my bowl gouges. I set my arm at the third notch, or about 40 degrees.
 
I use a homemade tool that I designed way before Raptor's were ever thought of. My design came from a more complicated version by Mike Darlow. I use 1/4" luan plywood. I simply make a triangle with one leg that fits the V arm and the other side goes next to my grinder wheel. The V arm is set for the proper distance for the tool I'm makeing the jig for. I draw an arc to match the wheel and then draw a smaller arc so that it leaves just 2 points touching the wheel. That gives me 3 point contact of the wheel. I used to make one for each tool grind but I find that my spindle gouges and bowl gouges I grind the same way I just use a different nose angle so I put a V block of wood into the Oneway V to move the Wolverine jig forward. This gives me a 35 or 45 degree nose angle depending on which block I put in and a 55 degree angle for the bowl gouge. I never move the V arm so my grinds are duplicated each time. Here is a video that shows the jigs although I now just use a V block of the proper length and put the wolverine jig against it instead of sitting in a carved slot on top like in this video.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbggxj2kgyc&t=6s
 
john lucas said:
I use a homemade tool that I designed way before Raptor's were ever thought of. My design came from a more complicated version by Mike Darlow. I use 1/4" luan plywood. I simply make a triangle with one leg that fits the V arm and the other side goes next to my grinder wheel. The V arm is set for the proper distance for the tool I'm makeing the jig for. I draw an arc to match the wheel and then draw a smaller arc so that it leaves just 2 points touching the wheel. That gives me 3 point contact of the wheel. I used to make one for each tool grind but I find that my spindle gouges and bowl gouges I grind the same way I just use a different nose angle so I put a V block of wood into the Oneway V to move the Wolverine jig forward. This gives me a 35 or 45 degree nose angle depending on which block I put in and a 55 degree angle for the bowl gouge. I never move the V arm so my grinds are duplicated each time. Here is a video that shows the jigs although I now just use a V block of the proper length and put the wolverine jig against it instead of sitting in a carved slot on top like in this video.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xbggxj2kgyc&t=6s
Click to expand...

John,

How did you determine the initial size of the block or the 3 point templates? Trial and error?
 
Lately I have changed a little bit my sharpening methods. I am standardizing some grinds so that I don't have to change the settings on my jigs. I am using the Robo-Rest on one side and it's set to 40 degrees. I hand sharpen my Spindle roughing gouge, Stewart Batty ground gouge, my mini ornament tools, and my negative rake scraper, and skews on that. This side has a 120 grit white wheel. I use my Wolverine jig with the V arm locked down on the other side that has a CBN wheel. I do my bowl gouges both V and U on that and it's set up to give me roughly a 55 degree bevel. I sharpen my spindle gouges with exactly the same set up but simply put a block in the V arm to move them closer which changes the nose angle to a more acute grind.
 
Thanks John.

What I’m trying to understand is that if I have the v arm set for 60 degree grind, how much do I raise it via a block or move it forward to get to 40 or 30 grind. Only way I know how is to move it a little, grind and measure. Trial and error basically. Once the angle is found, mark it for repeat use. Is that what everyone does?
 
I cheated. I had my spindle gouges ground to angle I liked so I simply put them in the Wolverine jig and moved them forward in the V arm until the bevel was flat. Measured this distance and made a V block that long to sit in the V arm.
 
Fadi Zeidan said:
Thanks John.

What I’m trying to understand is that if I have the v arm set for 60 degree grind, how much do I raise it via a block or move it forward to get to 40 or 30 grind. Only way I know how is to move it a little, grind and measure. Trial and error basically. Once the angle is found, mark it for repeat use. Is that what everyone does?
Click to expand...

Raising it increases the angle and moving it forward decreases the angle. How much depends on the geometry of your set up. It would be necessary to know the exact wheel diameter and the vertical distance from wheel center to the v notch.

You can get eyeball close by holding a small plastic triangle next to the tool while sighting from the side and sliding the V arm. My opinion is that there isn't anything magic about getting a precise angle when first creating a grind. With subsequent sharpening, of course, it is important to set the angle right in order to minimize grinding. You can do this by coloring the bevel with a Sharpie. You can also do this by sighting from the side and looking at the light gap, but it's not quite as precise.
 
The issue of the Raptor setting gauge has come up several times recently There are a couple of problems with it. First, it costs money. John Lucas has showed how to make the equivalent for free. More importantly, it gives the indicated nose angle ONLY if the varigrind arm angle is set to 23-degrees and the gouge protrusion is 2.5-inches (or a combination of values of these parameters that places the nose of the gouge at the same position and angle). As mentioned by others, other mounting parameters do not matter as long everything remains within adjustment limits and freedom of movement is preserved. I have reservations about both the 23- degree choice for arm angle and the 2.5 inch gouge protrusion.

The arm angle has very little effect on the character of the grind obtained as long as the fingernail is short--say equal or less than the diameter of the gouge. An arm angle of 23-degees will produce about the same results as an angle twice as large. This is a matter of geometry. When grinding a short bevel, the jig does not have to be rocked very much from side to side, so the arm angle does not have much effect. However, if you want to produce a long side-grind on a gouge, say 1.5 diameters or more, the 23-degree arm angle will yield a rather blunt edge at the end of the wing. For that reason, many turners, including myself, have chosen a larger arm angle for use with all spindle and bowl gouges. Dave Thompson has set a sort of de facto standard of about 43-degrees (the fourth notch on the arm angle scale) for all of his gouges, and I have followed suit.

The specified gouge protrusion value of 2.5 inches fodr the Raptor gauge is 0.75 inches longer than the more commonly recommended value of 1.75 inches. This means that a gouge will have 0.75 inches shorter life before it must be discarded or treated as a special case in the sharpening setup. There is no advantage in the longer value, because any reasonable change in the protrusion value can be exactly compensated by changes in the V-arm position and to a lesser degree, the arm angle. Note however, that setting the protrusion to values much less that 1.75 inches may lead to the varigrind jig hitting the grinding wheel.
 
I was actually going to create a post about the Wolverine Jig and ask why I getting a really sharp point on my 3/8" bowl gouge using the recommended settings from the instructions. It's an awful and unusable grind to say the least. I set the vari-grind jig to the 23° while using the 2" stick out and the grind comes out very pointy. I found that if I set the vari-grind to something around 40°+ I get a nice rounded point. I also grind the wings swept back because I like to use the wings for shearing and scraping as well. I use the jig with the raptor setup jigs as well. I'm going to play around with the setting a little more so I can get some hard numbers to work with so I don't have to grind and re-grind until I get the desired results.
20180928_111459.jpg 20180928_111444.jpg 20180928_111356.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top