Hollow Form System?

[Ted Mellin]

I am about ready to take the dive and purchase some Hollow Form tools. Would like some input about which is the best to buy. Think I have narrowed it down to the Jamieson System or maybe the Monster Articulated Hollowing System. Need some feedback from some users. thanks - Ted

 

[hockenbery]

Ted,

I like the jamieson system.

It is easy to use, quick to set up.

the jamieson handle accepts any 3/4 tool and other diameter tools with adapters. If you want to use Bosh or Jordan tools they fit the handle.

best of luck,

-Al

 

[john lucas]

I own and use a homemade Jamieson style system and like it. I looked long and hard at the Monster tool set up and like it very much. I really like his laser attachment. It's very well made and quick to set up. It will also take all the tools on the market with certain adaptors. If I didn't already have the Jamieson system it would be a touch choice. What I like about the Jamieson style is there aren't any moving parts to go bad. What I like about the Monster tool is how compact it is and how solid and easy to adjust the laser is.

 

[Steve Worcester]

I have been using the Jamieson since I first saw it and have made a couple of my own since. It is easy to setup, I have used altered version of it to hollow 20" deep.

Some will depend on how large you want to go, but either system will work fine.

 

[Jamie Donaldson]

Go Monster, and maybe add....

...John Jordan's 3/4" hollowing tools that fit as a suppliment bonus.

 

[George Guadiane]

Go Monster and Maybe Add

...John Jordan's 3/4" hollowing tools that fit as a suppliment bonus.

The Rolly Munro tools fit like fingers in a glove too... Not that you would NEED them, but they work as hand held AND fit in the monster!

It's what I use. Make sure to get the upgraded laser, it is an excellent improvement!

 

[Doug Stevens]

Jamison works

for me, I've been using it for a year now, easy to set up, easy to use. Lyle supports the system and is always willing to answer questions from folks that have purchased the system. Laser makes turning hollow forms a lot easier for everyone, especially beginners like I was when I got his system.

Doug

 

[robert davis]

i made my jameison system from lyles info when he first published it years ago. still use it ..see noreason to try any of the later exotic ones..!!!

 

[Scott wheeler]

Ted,

I'll second what Al said, I've used the Jameison for six months now with the laser attachment and love it for hollow forms and deep natural edge work, its east to setup and my 3/4" Stewart & Jordan tools fit as well.

Scott

 

[Dale Gillaspy]

Monster

Jamieson makes a great tool, no argument. I happen to like the Monster. I also have the articulated system, and I really love it. Smooth action, and it has done everything I have ever asked it to do, better than I could have hoped for. Go Monster.

 

[hockenbery]

a likely irrelevant point

If you think you might go into the really big forms.
2-4 feet tall or the 3 foot diameter the experience you get with the small trapped system will be a real plus.

Everyone I know who does these uses a custom made trapped system - the Jamieson handle on steroids and large diameter bars that take two men and boy to lift.


-Al

 

[davidwalser]

Another likely irrelevant point: Short-bed lathe owners may prefer using an articulated system to a Jamieson-style system. I have a short-bed lathe. With a Jamieson-style back support mounted and the tool rest mounted in front of it, there wouldn't be any room left for the turning blank itself. With my Monster articulated system, most of the tool hangs off the back of the lathe -- letting me hollow a blank that's almost as long as the bed.

To do that with a Jamieson-style, I'd have to create an auxiliary stand off the end of the lathe. That's very doable, but it's more work for short-bed lathe owners.

 

[Jerry A Arnold]

Don Geiger Report

I have two of the Kobra systems. One is the Green model designed for use on mini lathes and I had Jerry, at Kobra, build me a system to support it on my Stubby. I also have a Red model system that fits my Stubby (16" over the bed) and Jerry has supplied me with what I need to adapt it to lathes up to 24" for my demos.

The Kobra has a thrust bearing at each joint which, if I remember correctly, is rated at 1,850 lbs of torque. The tension of each joint is adjustable and there is no slop, vibration or noise even when it is full extended. The Red Kobra comes with a 1" i.d. receiver that has two set screws for securing the boring bar. I have the 1" X 15" bar and adapters for 3/4", 5/8", and 1/2" bars. Additionally, I use a set of Trent Bosch bars and several others. The 1" bar that is supplied with the Kobra is center drill with a 1/2" hole to accept their straight, 22.5 and 45 degree tool bit holders and two scraper bits holders. One thing I really like about their tool bit supports is they have square broached holes to accept standard tool bits without having to round them first!!! This is huge! I buy a box of bits from a machinist's supply and sharpen both ends of each so all I have to do when one gets dull is to flip it around and keep turning. Also, not having to pre-round or purchase pre-rounded bits saves time and money. I have the tool bit supports for 1/4" and 3/16" square bits. I even have carbide bits with square shanks that fit into the holders.

I asked Jerry to make me an 1/2" thick off-set plate to place the intitial pivot point behind the bed of the lathe several inches (about 6")which gives me more reach for getting under the lip of hollow forms. I can also attach the plate to the auxilary bed of my Stubby which gives me much more flexibility. This extension plate is now standard with all Kobras.

I couldn't be happier with the products or the service at Kobra.

Jerry called me the other day and they have some Kobras in-stock now and can ship quickly. He can be reached at jatooling@yahoo.com .

Don Geiger

 

[Vaughn]

I've got the Monster version of the Jamieson-style captive bar as well as the Monster Articulating Arm rig. Of the two, I prefer the Articulating Arm. It's smoother, takes up less space, easier (for me) to control, and it's faster to set up.

...One thing I really like about their tool bit supports is they have square broached holes to accept standard tool bits without having to round them first!!! This is huge! I buy a box of bits from a machinist's supply and sharpen both ends of each so all I have to do when one gets dull is to flip it around and keep turning. Also, not having to pre-round or purchase pre-rounded bits saves time and money...

The square holes sound like a good idea, but I've used a variety of purchased and home made boring bars with the standard tool bits in round holes. The holes are simply large enough to accomodate the square bit profile, and I've never had the need to round off the bits before using them. I also sharpen both ends so I can flip the bit when it gets dull.

Also, the Monster Articulating Arm system uses thrust bearings (a pair of them) at each joint, too.

[Disclaimer: I'm a bit biased towards the Monster tools, since Randy is a friend and client of mine.]

 

[Dale Bright]

...John Jordan's 3/4" hollowing tools that fit as a suppliment bonus.

Jamie,

On July 2nd, you posted: "Go Monster, and maybe add....
...John Jordan's 3/4" hollowing tools that fit as a suppliment bonus."

Are you using the 3/4" tools with the articulated system and if so what type of adapter are you using for the 5/8" hole in the Monster? I have read about others trying to use 3/4" tools with the Monster articulated system but getting too much chatter and vibration. I think Reed Gray posted something about using the 3/4" McNaughton tolls but they do take a bigger cut than the Jordan tools.

I have the 1/2" Jordan tools and an adapter that I am now using in my articulated system.

Dale Bright

 

[Jamie Donaldson]

Hi Dale I have just now found...

...your question, and Rick has a variety of step up/down adapters for the Monster system. I have several versions of 3/4" cutting bars, including the bigger Jordan tools, and they work just fine in the Monster set-up with the 5/8" to 3/4" adapter.

 

[Don Geiger]

Kobra features that provides some advantages

Below is a photo of the Kobra with it retracted over the initial pivot point. I don't have a photos of it, but it will also extend toward the tail stock as far as it will toward the head stock.

Because it has four bearinged joints and it can be moved over the initital pivot point so you get the maximium useage out of it without restriction. Some systems can't be moved over the intitial pivot point. They hit which limits the movement. The Kobra provides the maximum accessibility when hollowing.

Don Geiger

 

[Dan Mosley]

i have the Monster articulating rig and like it alot. The big thing I like is that the owner is always around to answer questions and the support it very good. It also comes with alot of accessories.

 

[Bernie Weishapl]

I have both of the monster system. The articulating arm and captured unit. Both are well built and love using both. If I could have just one it would be the articulating unit.

 

[Don Geiger]

I have 4 hollowing systems

I have 4 hollowing systems plus several hand held ones. The system I have are:

Home-built P captured rest system (miniature of the Frank Sudol- about the same size as the Jamieson)

Frank Sudol system w/6' long, 1.5" diameter, 40 lb bar and free standing capture system (I've added a laser)
NOTE: It is my understanding that Frank Sudol pioneered the captured rest system and his preceded the Jamieson by a few years. Jamieson's is similar to Sudol's but, by comparison, Sudol's is looks like it is on steroids and doesn't vibrate until you get to about 20 " off the tool rest.

Red Koba multi-articulated system for 16" through 24" lathes

Green Kobra for mini lathes and I have an adapter so I can use it on a 16" lathe too.

I have not used my home built P captured rest system since I got the Kobras. I think I've used the Sudol once since I got the Kobras. The only reason I keep the Sudol is it can go to 22" deep very nicely and for sentimental value. I admired Frank greatly. I even have photos of him using the system. Frank was a great guy and an inspiration to all who met him.


Don Geiger

 

[Charles Henderson]

Though I don't have experience with other systems, I have to throw in my vote for the articulated system from Randy @ Monster Lathe Tools/Superior Design & Machine.

As others have said the quality of the machining is well above par. In fact, I don't believe I have a better made tool in the shop. It came with every accessory you could possibly need, but I did have him thrown in a swan neck bar in the box for a small additional charge. The swan bar has only been used on a couple of wide forms with high shoulders.

I have turned bigger than I was advised to, with only moderate vibration. That was on a 15"w x 9"h form out of dripping wet Elm. For the most part, the worst of the vibration was high in the shoulder, but it was still quite workable.

You can't ask for better service either. Randy is a great guy, and he'll do whatever is needed to make you a happy customer.

For more replies on the subject, you can check out the thread I started last year on the same subject. http://www.aawforum.org/vbforum/showthread.php?t=6312&highlight=hollowing+system Just ignore Jason

 

[glenkey]

I see...

several folks talking about the "Kobra system". Is there a website for this or how do I go about finding out more about it.
Thanks

 

[Don Geiger]

Kobra contacts

I don't believe Kobra has a web site. However, you can contact them directly at: jatooling@yahoo.com or call: 765-534-4437. Ask for Jerry Arnold.

There are a couple of videos on Youtube that show how to set the system up and use it. Search for: Kobra Depp Hollowing.

Don Geiger

several folks talking about the "Kobra system". Is there a website for this or how do I go about finding out more about it.
Thanks