I have been wood working for several years now and have decided to try my hand at turning. I want to start with what is classified as a midi lathe (not mini ) I have Been looking at the new variable speed turncrafter pro from penn state they have had a turncrafter pro out which they claim to be award winning but the varible speed was just released. also was looking at the ricon that wood craft is selling but it is not variabe speed. you can change speeds by changing belt position on step pulley. how important is it to have variable speed when turning pens and other small items. any feedback regarding this will be appreciated
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midi lathe inquiry
- Thread starter dennisww
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The stepped pulley arrangement is much better than variable speed from the perspective of torque and cost. Variable speed in pen turning is not a big issue and the belt on the stepped pulleys can be changed in just a few seconds.
Bill
Bill
boehme said:
I agree with Bill. I have a Delta midi with step pulleys and it has way more torque than the Jet variable speed machine, of comparable size, that I've used. Not a big deal with pen turning but it makes quite a difference if you want to mount a small block and turn a bowl. Switching the belt between pulleys is easy on the delta requiring only about 10 seconds, if that. The Jet with pulleys is only slightly more difficult because of how they positioned the upper pulley door.
- Scott
i have had both.would never buy a lathe without variable speed!!!
john lucas
AAW Forum Expert
I currently own 2 jet mini's, one variable speed and one with step pulleys. I prefer the step pulleys for bowls because it has noticeably more torque. I do miss being able to fine tune the speed but not very much. There's also much less to go wrong with a single speed motor and thier cheaper to replace if something does go wrong.
I think the new Rikon might be good altenative to the Jet. We know the Jet is a solid performer with a good track record. The Rikon looks and feels good but it's still new on the market.
I think the new Rikon might be good altenative to the Jet. We know the Jet is a solid performer with a good track record. The Rikon looks and feels good but it's still new on the market.
I have the step pully in my mini and variable in my maxi. Belt change is quick and easy and I've found that fine tuning the speed is much more important in my large lathe than in my mini. Personal opinion is to go for the step pully in the small lathe and use the extra bucks for tools and accessories. Also, with the variable speed minis becoming so ubiquitous, you might be able to pick up a floor model of an older style for super cheap.
Dietrich
Dietrich
I would not buy a lathe without VS. I have two Vicmarc minis both with VS and my 20" original Woodfast also with VS. If I need more torque on any lathe I change pulley to a lower speed range. Gives more torque and still have the speed I need. I feel once you use VS you won't want to go back to changing pulleys. I turn everything from pens to near 20" pieces and find VS very useful if not absolutely necessary. And when you upgrade from a mini to a larger lathe the mini will make a great second lathe with VS being a great feature. VS on minis costs about $100, well worth it in my opinion.
As you can see..there are 2 groups when it comes to preference.
I am with the VS group. I know it takes only a few seconds to change belts but for me...it is annoying. I don't like the interruption...turning a knob is so much faster
Both my lathes are VS.
I am with the VS group. I know it takes only a few seconds to change belts but for me...it is annoying. I don't like the interruption...turning a knob is so much faster
Both my lathes are VS.
I had the Delta Midi with step pulleys and never bothered me to change the belt, and it was a strong peformer. Used a couple of the early model Jet Mini's with VS at a workshop, hated the lack of power. I moved up to a Jet 1642 2 hp with VS and don't know how I ever did without VS. But, to be honest, comparing the 2 hp w/VS to a mini/midi is just not the same thing.
Recently I had a chance to turn on a newer model Jet mini VS and it appears to have a lot more power than the early models (or maybe my technique has just gotten better?). All things being equal I would not be hesitant to get the Jet mini VS model today.
Recently I had a chance to turn on a newer model Jet mini VS and it appears to have a lot more power than the early models (or maybe my technique has just gotten better?). All things being equal I would not be hesitant to get the Jet mini VS model today.
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Tomato tomahto. Potato potahto. The pulleys will vary the speed, just not continuously. How important is it to do that? Not very. Velocity varies with distance from the axis of rotation, and we don't bother to stop and change in mid peel.
Takes thirty seconds to change a belt position versus two to crank and verify. Are we in a pit of poisonous snakes that we need to kill rapidly, or are we turning for pleasure? I rather suspect it mostly feels good to crank the dial. Or to look at the LEDs. Used to take the VIPs on tours of our facilitiy back when, and though the real work was done up front with typewriters and encrypting machines, they always spent the most time watching the lights flash on the machines downstairs. Didn't have the heart to tell them that channel active flashes might just be synch bauds. They wanted Star Trek.
Takes thirty seconds to change a belt position versus two to crank and verify. Are we in a pit of poisonous snakes that we need to kill rapidly, or are we turning for pleasure? I rather suspect it mostly feels good to crank the dial. Or to look at the LEDs. Used to take the VIPs on tours of our facilitiy back when, and though the real work was done up front with typewriters and encrypting machines, they always spent the most time watching the lights flash on the machines downstairs. Didn't have the heart to tell them that channel active flashes might just be synch bauds. They wanted Star Trek.
Good point. However, as a person who makes a living using a computer, I can tell you that it's the little things that add up to make some programs a royal pain to use. Every second, extra click, and extra mouse movement seems to make a big difference. By the time the big crash comes, you're already steaming because it's been pickin' at you for hours...
So, although I prefer the stepped pulleys over the variable speed on my Jet* mini for HP reasons, at times it sure would be nice just to ease that speed down quick....
*I love this little lathe!
thanks for all of the info it seems to be split down the middle vs versus step pulley. I did notice that on the turncrafterpro vs by pennstate it is step pulley with variable speed so that may compensate for lack of torque as some of you had mentioned. what I really would like to know is how is the turncrafter pro 1/2 (tcpro) performs. The tcprovs just came out so I don't exspect to get much feed back on that onedennisww said:
You're right. I am very thankful all my lathes are VS.
Reading a lot of topics like this it seems to me that a lot of new turners do not realize the the VS lathes also have multiple pulleys. The different pulleys give the turners a range of speeds with the lower ranges having more torque than the upper ranges. Very useful.
Reading a lot of topics like this it seems to me that a lot of new turners do not realize the the VS lathes also have multiple pulleys. The different pulleys give the turners a range of speeds with the lower ranges having more torque than the upper ranges. Very useful.
Yes, that would be folks who like VS and those who just want a belt.Dario said:
I have two dedicated lathes plus a semi-VS Shopsmith. Problem with the sS is that it doesn't get slow enough and I don't have the speed reducer (yet!) I've turned on Jet, Delta, and PM VS machines. It's nice, but I can live with my belted tools for a nice long time. Minor deal. I don't have those sorts of deadlines. When I get "THE" lathe, I'm sure that one of the bells or whistles will indeed be VS, plus the ability to turn a 55-gallon drum sized piece of wood or porch posts, one of the two...or both...
I can dream, can't I??
Last edited:
be more understanding
It has nothing to do with being thankful because if you read original topic it was about asking turners with experience for advice so as to be more informed about what is best to buy. and I think your comment was rude and not helpfull at all. I have been wood working for years and every woodworking forum I have been on has been nothing but helpfull. But now that I have Decided to try turning I have seen several rude comments from people that is not trying to help at all on this forum I think if you don't have good advice for new turners than you should not reply to our topic questions at all.Hamonrye said:
dennisww said:
Dennis,
I think the response wasn't meant to be rude at all. Hope you take (forum) messages a bit more lightly.
SMILE!!!
General Has a new Midi
I saw a new Midi from General with VS and a sliding headstock with outboard turning capability to 20" swing (I think). Looks solid and is priced around $600 - might be worth a look
Ray
I saw a new Midi from General with VS and a sliding headstock with outboard turning capability to 20" swing (I think). Looks solid and is priced around $600 - might be worth a look
Ray
Hamonrye said:
I'm thankful that I now have a larger VS lathe but I was also thankful that I had my Delta Midi with belts originally. After looking at the weather this morning I am also thankful that my lathe is in Florida, in a heated shop (29 degrees here this morning, considered to be major weather problem for us), and a pot of coffee. I teach and the schools are opening two hours late due to the weather, seriously (OK, you northern folks quit laughing at us thin-blooded folks)! So I have some shop time this morning which is unusual.
dennisww, I have been on this forum for years and have seen very few rude comments. Maybe a few smart alecks but rarely rude. Most of the people that come here with rude comments go to other forums because we won't play with them here. I understand how you read the comment but I am sure it was more of smart aleck comment than rude. You won't find a group more supportive to new turner with new problems or old turners with old problems.
dennisww said:
I have the TCPRO with extension bed. I wanted to try my hand at turning but couldn't justify spending a fortune on a machine if I turned out to A) not enjoy the craft or B) stink at it. That lathe was dandy for doing spindles and lidded boxes, okay at small bowls.
Then the turning vortex caught hold of me and within the first year I upgraded to a Jet 16". The TCPRO with extension bed and a pair of PSI chucks is hiding under a shelf. The fortune that I could not justify spending initially has since been spent. And respent.
And spent again.
Man I love buying tools (insert appropriate Tim-The-Tool-Man-Taylor sound effect here).
VS vs. Belt
If you'll only be turning pens, bottle stoppers, boxes, and other spindle related items, whichever option you choose won't really make much difference. If you get into bowl turning, you will need to focus on how SLOW the lathe can go.
Almost all bowl turning is below 1000 RPM, pen turning will vary from 1000 - 3000 RPM. When bowl blanks are being roughed out (turned round for the 1st time from a block of wood) you will WANT to have a speed slower than 500 RPM for anything larger than a 10" diameter.
The real advantage of VS or handle adjusted speed over the belt is that you can quickly realize that you have started the lathe while it was set to spin too fast and make the adjustment on the fly rather than having to turn the lathe off and change the belt. Having a standard methodology of starting your lathe (check to make sure the block spins clear of the tool rest, verify the speed setting via eyeballing the belt or the vs dial, making sure you have eye protection, standing clear of the rotating block when starting, etc) will go a long way to addressing this safety issue even if you have a belt.
I've used belt driven Jet minis, handle adjusted Deltas, and a VS Powermatic. For bowl turning, I love the VS because I can slow my RPMs down so much. You can easily turn 10" bowls on a belt driven Jet which has a bottom speed of about 500 RPM. If you muscle up to bigger bowl blanks, then you will want to seriously look at the range of speed.
Most of the lower priced lathes (sub $600) have a low speed of 500 RPM which is fine for most things, because they also have a smaller swing. If you start going all Tim Taylor (arghhh, arghhh!) then you need to consider a larger lathe, and slower speeds over everything else for your safety if nothing else. Don't forget a face shield in your purchasing as they really are necessary whether you are turning bowls or pens. Its really hard to do a lot of things if you're blind or have super glued your eye shut!
May all your turnings be smooth,
Brodie
If you'll only be turning pens, bottle stoppers, boxes, and other spindle related items, whichever option you choose won't really make much difference. If you get into bowl turning, you will need to focus on how SLOW the lathe can go.
Almost all bowl turning is below 1000 RPM, pen turning will vary from 1000 - 3000 RPM. When bowl blanks are being roughed out (turned round for the 1st time from a block of wood) you will WANT to have a speed slower than 500 RPM for anything larger than a 10" diameter.
The real advantage of VS or handle adjusted speed over the belt is that you can quickly realize that you have started the lathe while it was set to spin too fast and make the adjustment on the fly rather than having to turn the lathe off and change the belt. Having a standard methodology of starting your lathe (check to make sure the block spins clear of the tool rest, verify the speed setting via eyeballing the belt or the vs dial, making sure you have eye protection, standing clear of the rotating block when starting, etc) will go a long way to addressing this safety issue even if you have a belt.
I've used belt driven Jet minis, handle adjusted Deltas, and a VS Powermatic. For bowl turning, I love the VS because I can slow my RPMs down so much. You can easily turn 10" bowls on a belt driven Jet which has a bottom speed of about 500 RPM. If you muscle up to bigger bowl blanks, then you will want to seriously look at the range of speed.
Most of the lower priced lathes (sub $600) have a low speed of 500 RPM which is fine for most things, because they also have a smaller swing. If you start going all Tim Taylor (arghhh, arghhh!) then you need to consider a larger lathe, and slower speeds over everything else for your safety if nothing else. Don't forget a face shield in your purchasing as they really are necessary whether you are turning bowls or pens. Its really hard to do a lot of things if you're blind or have super glued your eye shut!
May all your turnings be smooth,
Brodie
[QUOTE=guess your right the remarks are more smart aleck than down and out rude but smart aleck remarks is just sugar coated rudeness no matter how you look at it and since I have gotton couple of responses from you long time members than I guess it is ok to you guys. but I am serious about my wood working and think I am finished with this forum. but I thank everyone that had actual good advice about my original question about mini lathes it gave me some things to ponder.
dennisww said:
So as I look at it there were 23 replies to your original question, which is above average. After reading all of them again I only see one that offered no advice, 3 I think were from you as followups, 1 or 2 general observations, and all the rest was a very civilized discussion of pros and cons of VS. Not sure how much more helpful we could've been. I hate to see anyone leave with bad feelings, but I think this was about as much good advice as you will get anywhere with less garbarge than most forums have.
VS vs. step pulleys just simply is not a black and white issue. Both have their advantages, you asked opinions and we gave the pros and cons, but ultimately you have to make the decision. If there was one perfect lathe for everyone we would have little to discuss on here. AAW and this forum have been a wonderful source of info, online friendships, and support. Not sure what you were looking for . . .
Geesh, lighten up DennisWW it was just a comment. A friend of mine just lost his entire shop due to a fire and he is THANKFULL that he was able to save his lathe and a few tools. Be THANKFULL for what you have, some have nothing left but ashes. Merry Christmas everyone!!