Short bed lathe???? Why would you want one?

[Odie]

I've never been able to understand the value of the short bed lathe.....even if all you ever make is bowls. It just doesn't look like there is enough room at the end of the bed for you to stand close enough to your work, so what's the advantage?

I have a long bed Woodfast lathe, and there are times where I stand behind the lathe to get into position for a special purpose cut. It's easy to go around the back side. When I do go around to the back, it's handy to brace your body against the added length of the long bed lathe. It helps steady the tool for a better cut.....not to mention that the same applies when working in the front, too.

I can see how, when using a short bed lathe, it's necessary to remove the tailstock when it's not being used.....looks to me like it'll just get in the way because it can't be moved out of the way far enough. That, to me, seems like a hassle, because you need to lug that thing somewhere, and find a place to stick it. With the long bed lathe, I simply move my tailstock to the end of the bed rails....and, viola, it's out of the way!....the simplicity of this is a pleasure.

I also see how the added weight of the long bed, and width between the lathe feet, is an advantage for bowl turning.....especially when an out-of-balance condition exists.

All of these reasons add up to positive reasons for getting a long bed lathe, even when your main purpose is bowl turning......but, you tell me why you prefer the short bed lathe. I need some convincing.

....otis of Cologne

 

[GeorgeH]

I don't have the luxury of owning a large shop area. But I do have a desire to work with wood; AND design, build, and repair things that are mechanical, electrical, electronic, etc. That means I need space for my welding equipment, electronic equipment, automotive/mechanical equipment, woodworking tools, etc. The only way to serve all of those desires is to create an environment for tool portability.
My Delta LA200 lathe looks like the first photo when it's not in use. When I roll it out, and do not need the full length bed (it's stored below the lathe in the photo) it serves me well configured as in the second photo.
If I need the full length bed it takes only a few minutes to set it up as in the third photo. I could not engage in wood turning if it required a full size lathe.
That's why....................

 

[Odie]

Howdy nuturner.....

And all this time, I've been thinking the reason short bed lathes exist is for some functional application towards the making of bowls! This is something I've never quite understood.

Ok, so what you're telling me is the reason for short bed lathes is for the purpose of saving shop space? That I can understand.

Thanks

....odie

Looks like your shop space is well organized. Say, what is that wooden frame that looks like it's on a pivot near the floor, directly below the headstock?

 

[GeorgeH]

Howdy nuturner.....
...Say, what is that wooden frame that looks like it's on a pivot near the floor, directly below the headstock?

I needed a method for adding wheels for "trucking" the lathe stand around so I devised a frame onto which I added wheels. When the frame is in the forward position the front end of the lathe stand rests on the wheels; hence I use the handles at the other end to move it about like a wheelbarrow. What you see in the picture is a set of casters - the original design. It didn't work as smoothly as I had hoped so I replaced them with an axle through the vertical members of the frame onto which I installed pneumatic tired wheels (the type you'd find on a hand truck, etc.) about 8 inches tall. This works much better; smoother and easier to roll. When I get the lathe where I want it I simply swing the frame rearward and the lathe stand rests on its own legs - that's more stable than having it rest on the wheels at one end and the legs of the stand at the other.

 

[Brian Hahn]

I've never been able to understand the value of the short bed lathe.....even if all you ever make is bowls. It just doesn't look like there is enough room at the end of the bed for you to stand close enough to your work, so what's the advantage?

Well, the short bed for my lathe is 14" long. That lets me stand at the end of the bed when I'm turning bowls. And it keeps me well out of the throw zone.

 

[Odie]

Well, the short bed for my lathe is 14" long. That lets me stand at the end of the bed when I'm turning bowls. And it keeps me well out of the throw zone.

What kind of lathe do you have, Brian?

If you can show us a picture, that would be great.

I was looking at the Vicmarc 300 lathe, and that inspired this thread. It sure doesn't look like there's enough room to stand there directly facing the headstock on that one. The shortbed Woodfast is the same way. I see the Oneway2000 has a 16" capacity between centers. This one may be short enough, but there is no picture available on that one. If anyone can supply a pic of the Oneway2000 shortbed, I'd appreciate that. Offhand, the Oneway2000 looks pretty bulky with that tube bed, but I'm only guessing here. Your actual findings may be different.

Thanks for any input on this you may wish to offer.

....odie

 

[Odie]

I needed a method for adding wheels for "trucking" the lathe stand around so I devised a frame onto which I added wheels. When the frame is in the forward position the front end of the lathe stand rests on the wheels; hence I use the handles at the other end to move it about like a wheelbarrow. What you see in the picture is a set of casters - the original design. It didn't work as smoothly as I had hoped so I replaced them with an axle through the vertical members of the frame onto which I installed pneumatic tired wheels (the type you'd find on a hand truck, etc.) about 8 inches tall. This works much better; smoother and easier to roll. When I get the lathe where I want it I simply swing the frame rearward and the lathe stand rests on its own legs - that's more stable than having it rest on the wheels at one end and the legs of the stand at the other.

Pretty ingenious, nuturner.....

I see the "wheelbarrow" handles now.....and it makes sense.

thanks

....odie

 

[KEW]

I think that the best benefit of a short bed lathe is for hollow turning. It is more natural to stand at the end of the lathe using an armbrace than leaning in from the side.
Of course, if your lathe has a sliding head, you can make the bed whatever length you want, so that is the best solution, IMHO.

 

[Dario]

I think that the best benefit of a short bed lathe is for hollow turning. It is more natural to stand at the end of the lathe using an armbrace than leaning in from the side.
Of course, if your lathe has a sliding head, you can make the bed whatever length you want, so that is the best solution, IMHO.

And that (among other things) is why PM 3520B rocks :cool2:

 

[waltben]

More than just a short bed . . .

If you can't afford a Stubby, a short bed is the next best thing. Although my 750's 'footprint' is only 36" wide, I can spindle turn a bit over 34" by extending the bed. It'll spin 16" over the bed, and if I retract it a bit, I can turn 30" in diameter. Look at http://www.stubbylatheusa.com/cgi-bin/index.py

 

[Brian McInturff]

Here! Here! for the Stubby. I got my 750 because the sliding pivoting bedallows for a lot of variations especially for squatty HF's. It breaks down easy if you need to take it to do a demo. I'm no where good enough yet to do demos but hope to some day. I also like the footprint of it. Plus I just don't ever see myself doing a bunch of spindles. Most people who spend the money on a Stubby usually have a mini and if you need to do a spindle longer than 34" you can always get an extension bed for your mini. Myself, my mini is a Oneway 1018 with extension bed. But I've never had to use the extension. I kept it just in case someone else wants to turn at the same time I'm turning.
Brian

 

[Bill Siler]

Short bed lathe fan

I've used a short bed Woodfast for almost 20 years. I am very attached to the practice of standing at the end of the lathe -- especially for hollowing -- and I've always been happy that I didn't get the long bed Woodfast. If I weren't fairly tall (about 6 feet), I don't think I'd have enough reach to stand at the end of the lathe. But at my height, it's comfortable and let's me keep the tool tucked in against my body. I would not want to give that up. I have just replaced my short bed lathe with a long bed lathe, but I chose one with a sliding headstock.

 

[john lucas]

Nobody has mentioned the strain on your back so I will. Standing at the end of the lathe is so much more relaxing when turning bowls or hollowing vessels. The sliding headstock of my powermatic lets adjust the headstock so it's just right for bowls or slide it back a little for hollow vessels where I might need a steady rest. Swinging headtocks work the same way for bowls. Your standing pretty upright with relaxed shoulders. It's much less stressful.
If you want a really short bed go with the VEga 2400. Some of the other short beds like the Vicmarc and Stubby really aren't that short. They work for hollow vessels but your still kind of far away for bowls unless it's a large bowl.
Oops I forgot the VB36. It doesn't have a bed so it's really short. Well actually you can buy a bed and add it.
I like to start my bowls and hollow vessels between centers so a short bed won't work for me on larger vessels. That's where the sliding bed comes in handy.

 

[Brian McInturff]

John,
One thing I like with the Stubby and I'm sure you can do it on the Powermatic also, is to be able to turn from both sides of the lathe I stand half the time on the right side. I'm an unorthadox lefty. The stubby seems more comfortable for me than the PM doing this. Just no way to do it on a fixed headstock longbed. With the Stubby I'm able to pivot the bed so I can dip the handle down for a lot of my cuts which you can't do on the PM or others for that matter. The VB36 was very high on my list when I was looking, until I actually went and checked one out. I would've had to have built a platform to stand on to turn comfortable. And there is just no way to do that in my small shop. It's a great lathe though(and expensive).
Brian

 

[Brian Hahn]

What kind of lathe do you have, Brian?

odie,
I have an old Conover lathe, which basically is a headstock, tailstock and variable speed motor. I built my own stand/base and a series of beds for it that range from 14" to 60" in length. It suited my needs and situation when I bought it back in '96 and there weren't nearly as many choices back then.

If I were to buy a new lathe now, I would get a top-of-the-line sliding headstock lathe made by a fellow who lives 35 minutes down the road from me. (i.e. a Robust)

 

[John Brown]

I see the Oneway2000 has a 16" capacity between centers. This one may be short enough, but there is no picture available on that one. If anyone can supply a pic of the Oneway2000 shortbed, I'd appreciate that. Offhand, the Oneway2000 looks pretty bulky with that tube bed, but I'm only guessing here.
....odie

What is a Oneway 2000? I have searched the Oneway web site and cannot find that model.
John.

 

[Odie]

What is a Oneway 2000? I have searched the Oneway web site and cannot find that model.
John.

John.....

The Oneway 2000 is available at CSUSA.

Here's a link:

http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/catalog/oneway2000.html

....odie

Keep the comments comming, gents......I'm finding this thread very interesting.

 

[Brian McInturff]

Correction guys on a Oneway2000. That is a series of lathes. The 2016 and the 2036. Then their is the 24 sereis 2416, and 2436. If you search these #'s you will find a wealth of info.

Brian

 

[Odie]

Nobody has mentioned the strain on your back so I will. Standing at the end of the lathe is so much more relaxing when turning bowls or hollowing vessels. The sliding headstock of my powermatic lets adjust the headstock so it's just right for bowls or slide it back a little for hollow vessels where I might need a steady rest. Swinging headstocks work the same way for bowls. Your standing pretty upright with relaxed shoulders. It's much less stressful.

Interesting, John.....

I've never had a short bed lathe, so I can only go by theory, but it sure seems my long bed would be less of a strain on my back than standing facing the spindle straight on....without anything to lean on. I lean on my long bed lathe all the time, and it seems to give me excellent support, both for my body and the lathe tool as well.....but, like I said, I've never done it any other way.

For sure, the sliding PM headstock is an interesting proposition, too. I'd sure like to try one of those out. It seems like it would be a solution that fits everyone, no matter what their requirements may be.

I've never done a hollow form, nor do I have any interest in it at the present time, but I assume a little longer bedway would be better for this because hollow forms are usually a little taller than a bowl......am I right about that, or is there some other reason why hollow forms do better with some amount of bed length?

....otis of Cologne

 

[Odie]

Correction guys on a Oneway2000. That is a series of lathes. The 2016 and the 2036. Then their is the 24 sereis 2416, and 2436. If you search these #'s you will find a wealth of info.

Brian

Yes, that's correct, turf.....

I didn't differentiate between series and model numbers.....sorry 'bout that!

....odie

 

[john lucas]

Brian If you move the headstock out to the end of the powermatic there isn't even a bed to get in the way. Since you can slide the headstock you can adjust this distance from all the way to the end where you would need a free standing tool rest or slide it back a little so you can use the original tool rest. Or slide it back more so you can use a steady rest and tool rest.
I never lean on the lathe except sometimes when hollowing boxes. They go so fast I don't bother moving the headstock. I use my body to control the tools so moving around a lot is a must. Being able to stand at the end lets me move more freely and since I'm not bent over it's much easier on the neck.
I know I'm talking about the Powermatic but the Jet 16 and Robust also have sliding headstocks. In fact the Robust 16 I think has both sliding headstock and rotating headstock.

 

[Jake Debski]

Brian..................................I know I'm talking about the Powermatic but the Jet 16 and Robust also have sliding headstocks. In fact the Robust 16 I think has both sliding headstock and rotating headstock.

Since the builder of the Robust is so cooperative in answering questions, I'd like to ask, what is the purpose of a rotating head stock on a lathe that the HS can be slid to the end of the bed it seems redundant.? I think I know the answer but it is always good to hear it from the source. Thanks.

 

[john lucas]

I would be interested in hearing also. One of the problems with a sliding headstock is having the space to stand at the end of the lathe. With a rotating headstock you get many of the same benefits of a sliding headstock but it doesn't take up any spaces.
The disadvantage of the rotating headstock is that the tool rest doesn't always reach where you need to go without using an extension. The extensions cause vibration. Another disadvantage is having to align the headstock with the tailstock after you go back. I'm sure Robust did it right. I had a Delta and a Nova with rotating headstock and getting them back to normal was a pain without buying their double morse taper.

 

[MichaelMouse]

Don't know if this will save any back but mine, but if you use a different gouge to cut the wood at a different angle, you can stand upright 95% of the time when cutting and even hollowing. Examples of my choices and stances at http://s108.photobucket.com/albums/n28/MichaelMouse/ Save "the familiar" method of using the roughing gouge, where I had to use an underhand grip to show the shaving, everything is shot as I cut, moving the camera rather than the turner.

Since your forearm is about one cubit in length and the tool most of another, you should have no problem working to the center of things 20" in diameter or even more with no stooping. Your hands tell you how the tool is cutting, and the opposite side how the piece is looking without a problem.

 

[markb]

I am a new member of the AAW but I have been turning on and off for about 15 years. I have been studying the specs on many lathes looking to upgrade in the near future. I currently have a new Vicmarc VL100 mini that I am setting up and a Jet 1236 that I have been using for a while and is soon to be replaced with something more substantial.

I have wanted the shorted VL300 Vicmarc for quite some time. I guess the reason for the short bed would be limited space. Also, I have not done a lot of long spindle work that would require the long bed. I figured if I ever needed the long bed I could purchase the bed extension.

If I had the cash right now though I would purchase the Robust 25†lathe. I think this has many features designed into it that makes it a very versatile machine. Sliding headstock, stainless steel ways, adjustable spindle height, heavy duty bearings, large outboard ability, and Made in the USA are just a few features that I feel puts this lathe in a class of its own. I know I have looked at other brands that have some of these features but I have not found another that has so much to offer right out of the box.

There were a couple questions here on the Robust “Sweet 16â€Â. It has a fixed headstock and a removable section of the bed. That bed section can be bolted to the side of the headstock making an “L†shaped bed. This allows you to work from the side and back of the peice being turned. Removing the bed section also gives you a 30†swing over the gap in the bed.

Thanks to all for the great info I have gathered here over the past few months.

Mark

 

[Odie]

I am a new member of the AAW but I have been turning on and off for about 15 years. I have been studying the specs on many lathes looking to upgrade in the near future. I currently have a new Vicmarc VL100 mini that I am setting up and a Jet 1236 that I have been using for a while and is soon to be replaced with something more substantial.

I have wanted the shorted VL300 Vicmarc for quite some time. I guess the reason for the short bed would be limited space. Also, I have not done a lot of long spindle work that would require the long bed. I figured if I ever needed the long bed I could purchase the bed extension.

If I had the cash right now though I would purchase the Robust 25†lathe. I think this has many features designed into it that makes it a very versatile machine. Sliding headstock, stainless steel ways, adjustable spindle height, heavy duty bearings, large outboard ability, and Made in the USA are just a few features that I feel puts this lathe in a class of its own. I know I have looked at other brands that have some of these features but I have not found another that has so much to offer right out of the box.

There were a couple questions here on the Robust “Sweet 16â€Â. It has a fixed headstock and a removable section of the bed. That bed section can be bolted to the side of the headstock making an “L†shaped bed. This allows you to work from the side and back of the peice being turned. Removing the bed section also gives you a 30†swing over the gap in the bed.

Thanks to all for the great info I have gathered here over the past few months.

Mark

Howdy Mark....

I also hanker for the Vicmarc VL300......still do! For my purposes, I want the long bed, even though I seldom do spindle turning. I suppose we all make our purchases according to our perceptions of what we want based on our experiences.....I'm no different. I have been in the habit of leaning on my longbed Woodfast for nearly two decades, and I suppose old habits are hard to break.....not that I wish to, either. This is because my "leaning" has developed into a habit that I rather like. With some woods and shapes, I am able to get smoother cuts and "style" over what I can get without it. It also seems much easier on my back, in the long run. It works for me, but it would be beyond me to ever suggest that my way of doing things would be best for everyone else.

Those stainless steel Robust bedways are very appealing....on the surface. I've never had problems with rusting. I keep a oilrag on hand to swipe the ways once in a while. I think, if you check around, there are very few turners that have problems associated with rust.....unless they leave their lathes idle for extended periods of time. In order for it to be problematic, I'd think the rusting would have to be much more than a little surface rust. Also, I've always accepted the universal thinking that cast iron is the most stable platform for machinery surfaces that need to be unaffected by temperature....If I'm not mistaken, this is why most heavy duty industrial machinery still use cast iron today......because it's the most stable material for the need at hand.

That Robust Sweet 16 removable bed is a thought, for sure....if one was inclined to use it. To me, it smacks of the Shopsmith system.....a whizbang that is designed for many purposes, rather than getting the best serviceability for a particular need. Years ago I had a Shopsmith, and after years of use, I really hated to change over to the many set-ups it was capable of. I'm one who wants to dive into my work with a minimum of major set-up needs to contend with.

My intent is not to change your, or anyone else's mind about things. Heaven forbid! I'm merely throwing in my thoughts for consideration.

....otis of Cologne

 

[Fog Tanner]

I have both a movable head and a fixed long bed lathe. The movable head is the 16" Delta steel bed lathe and the fixed head long bed is the Vicmarc 300VL. I moved the head close to the end of the bed once on the Delta to turn a bowl, but for me there was no advantage so I moved it back to the other end. I turn bowls on my long bed Vic and don't really have any problems or need for a short bed.

What I do like about the long bed lathe is being able to slide the tailstock out of the way and bring it back when I need it. I have been truning some 19" Pecan bowls lately, using the tail stock as support when needed. After profiling the outside, I can move the tail stock down the bed and not worry about hitting it with a tool handle when I turn or core the inside. Raffin had both, and used the long bed for much the same reasons.

So for me the long bed is a matter of convience, as the tail stock on the Vic is heavy I don't kill my back moving it back and forth. But, it is like Ford and Chevy - everyone has an opinion and none of them really wrong for their situation - unless of course if its front wheel drive.

Fog

 

[Claude]

I have both long and short bed Vicmarc and I notice I end up on the short bed VL 300 most of the time. Why?
I must say I very rarely turn pieces longer than she short bed which in addition is very comfortable even for turning pieces up to 60 cm diameter… so why bother with the long bed

Fog Tanner
You should by the small bed pivoting extension, you won’t have to bother about the tail stock any more. Just open the extension and the tail stock is out of your way.

 

[Brodie Brickey]

Jake Debski
Since the builder of the Robust is so cooperative in answering questions, I'd like to ask, what is the purpose of a rotating head stock on a lathe that the HS can be slid to the end of the bed it seems redundant.? I think I know the answer but it is always good to hear it from the source. Thanks.

I can't speak for Robust, but like John L, I once owned a Delta 46-715 with sliding & rotating headstock. The advantage of having both options on that lathe was that you could turn outboard with a large piece of wood and not have the lathe tip over. If you didn't move the headstock to the center of the lathe, problems were bound to occur. The outboard turning rig on the delta was not up to par, nor where the bearings.

As for the question of having a short bed, there are a couple reasons:

• Footprint and lack of shop space.
• No large spindle turning planned.
• Have you ever worked a really large bowl and had your bowl gouge hit the bed as you were moving deeper into the bowl? I have on my PM3520A. I now just move the headstock further down the lathe and get around that problem. I don't know how I'd do it if I had a Oneway, probably outboard turn it.

Those are the main issues that come to mind. If you are in the market for a lathe, I would avoid the Delta line. I don't think they have their lathes really dialed in to handle the kind of abuse they should. If you're in that price range, go with a Nova or Jet instead.

Safe turnings.