"Spiritual turning"......

[Doug Freeman]

Tongue in cheek question, my imoji didnt show up. To do the the things I have athletically, academically, and professionally require just a bit of attention to detail, what some may consider a little or a lot OCD. Pursuit of excellence has been a mantra for the last 50 years or so. If you want to associate that with the term “spiritual”, ok, I never thought of it that way.

 

[odie]

Tongue in cheek question, my imoji didnt show up. To do the the things I have athletically, academically, and professionally require just a bit of attention to detail, what some may consider a little or a lot OCD. Pursuit of excellence has been a mantra for the last 50 years or so. If you want to associate that with the term “spiritual”, ok, I never thought of it that way.

OK, I think I understand your meaning, Doug.

I don't believe there is a direct relationship between "pursuit of excellence" and the essence of "spiritual"......until you throw in the psychological condition of "OCD" into the mix.....then, those three things can have a definite relationship, but that connection is not necessarily a foregone conclusion.

Now.....do I have OCD, when it comes to my pursuit of excellence through my woodturning passion?......that question might be worthy of consideration, but the answer to that makes little difference to me! The only thing that makes the slightest bit of difference, is the progress I make in my own very personal pursuit of excellence.......no matter what it takes to garner that progress.

-----odie-----

 

[John Jordan]

With all due respect, and I mean that sincerely, I must disagree. I believe many of us, be we professional or amateur, are capable of that dedication and that it shows in our work. That little bit of soul we leave in each piece that is loved by future generations, makes us immortal

I would tend to agree with that, John.

John

 

[John Tisdale]

My favorite all-time quote is from Andy Warhol: "I'm a deeply superficial person".
Something to aspire to.

 

[William Rogers]

I really didn’t know how to respond to this thread when first posted. I still am unsure this response is what fits. I do not take any commissioned work. Everytime I put wood on the lathe I have a concept of what the finished piece will be. However sometimes it ends up different because I feel the concept and wood didn’t match. Not always. For the connection I am always striving to make that one unique piece no one has ever done. I also try to make the best piece I can. I achieved that with my ship. I made the ship as a challenge from Hockenberry. I had made a natural edge bowl with a hole in the bottom. For fun I put a sail in it. Hockenberry said I need to make a ship with more detail. So my connection to this turning is strong. But there are pieces that are in a word awful that I had made. Some are ugly and I call those art and others are not the concept I had in mind and just no connection. In December I had what I call an “event” requiring two rounds of CPR. I was at the hospital doing cardiac rehab at the time, so I was in the right place. After I wanted to give several key personnel something and began making things. I had turnings made, but wanted these to be after the event, as they would not exist without their quick response. They had to be done well. I took them in last week and the staff were grateful to receive the gifts. One said that they will remember me when the look at the turning. I passed that connection to those responders.

This is my ship. Things just went well.



Now with that said, I guess I didn’t satisfy the Fire God. So I have an additional offering. This was my first attempt at a mini cowboy hat. brim was 9” in diameter and about 4” tall. Actually I got further along than I thought on my first attempt , but one cut too many on the inside top.

 

[John Tisdale]

Whatever you do, don't toss it to the fire. Covid will lift someday and we'll be back attending symposiums - you'll need something to wear. Every piece in the gallery and every piece made in the demos will be forgotten - all that will be remembered is your hat

 

[odie]

Part of that "spiritual-ness" is being alert to all the input your senses, body, and tools are giving you during the act of turning......and combining that with all other available precursor data and knowledge. This leads to contemplation, and then conclusions, thus realizing an advantage that can only be had through a spiritual connection.

I'm convinced the only persons who can relate to that, are those who don't need an explanation......

-----odie-----

 

[odie]

One thing I've noticed, is when I attempt to put into words, a concept that is a mental abstract......it becomes clearer to me. This is true of this thread. Obviously, there are those who disagree with my assessments, or evaluations of "spiritual turning", but they are very real to me. Since I first attempted to express what this concept means to me, it's been constantly in my thought process while turning bowls in my shop. I can't say I've been able to improve on the concept, but since it's been on my mind a lot, it's been clearer to me what it means to me, and my ability to incorporate it into my own turning methods. I believe this continuing thought process is enabling me to open doors that will lead to undiscovered advantages in refining my own personal processes.......

-----odie-----

 

[Aaron Harris]

Odie-I taught a high school Mythology and Religious Lit. elective for 15 years, and was always fascinated by Buddhism. Some of the concepts you are laying down here have a lot in common with it. Just an observation. And for some reason, I'm reminded of the scene in A River Runs Through It in which the brother comes home, watches his brother Paul "shadow-casting," and realizes that he has become an artist with the fly rod in the years of his absence.

I think that you can do almost any challenging human endeavor "spiritually" with heart and mindfulness, and come to gradual epiphanies and little spiritual awakenings as you do it. I can vouch that fly-fishing can be like this (just not when you're cursing over a spill in the river or getting hung up in overhanging branches!). Along those lines, just in the last few weeks I have started to lose my fear of the bowl gouge (and especially the fear I had of going deeper hollowing out bowls!). Somehow I just finally found "the sweet spot" with my gouges, learned to turn with body English instead of my hands and arms, how to really float the bevel, and just learned finally how to make smooth cuts all the way across to the center nub. Weird thing is, it happened seemingly all at once, after months of frustration and cheating with other tools. So quickly in fact that I was a little astonished by it. What changed? IDK-maybe the nightly bowl-turning video marathons somehow finally sank in all at once.

(I must also admit that the Lyle Jamieson bowl gouge I got really made a difference. I became so enamored of the grind that I have ground my other bowl gouges to match it-that thing can shear scrape like velvet).

 

[Mike Johnson]

If any of you ever get the chance to visit the Cairo museum check out the Granite Stone Bowls, Quartz Crystal Vases, and Schist Disc that were crafted by ancient Egyptians.
Thousands of the highly polished stone bowls were stashed in several tunnels under one of the smaller pyramids on the Giza plateau.
These craftsman surely had some lost skills or technologies that have yet to be rediscovered to this day.
Still looking for that book that explains how to turn Quartz Crystal.

 

[odie]

If any of you ever get the chance to visit the Cairo museum check out the Granite Stone Bowls,
These craftsman surely had some lost skills or technologies that have yet to be rediscovered to this day.

This one intrigues me.

After contemplating the shape, it looks like the profile curvature changes slightly just above the handles. This suggests that everything above and below the handles could conceivably have been done while it rotated on a potter's wheel......as long as they possessed the technology to produce cutting tools harder than the granite......which I think they did.



Everything within the level of the handles could have been done with hand tools, and we know they had those.....

Just a guess from my active imagination, not influenced by any knowledge of Egyptian history.

-----odie-----

 

[RichColvin]

Actually Holtzapffel and others that build Lathes FOR the KINGS and QUEENS, KYZER, GRAAF and for the other high and mighty's in Europe, it was the inn thing for these people to get the special woods and turn fancy pieces with these lathes.

At the prices these lathes went for it was only that kind of person to purchase them, even now if one of these complete lathes come up for sale, they command very high prices.

View attachment 37298
Not exactly a chair leg or bedpost turning lathe, more of a see what I can turn with my lathe.
Boasting a one better object, like an oval turned trinket.

Leo,

Holtzapffel only made about 16 rose engine lathes. Most of what they made was used by trades people. But, Holtzapffel also made ways to adapt rose engine cutting to those lathes using tools like a rose cutting frame. John Edwards has a great history of them if you’d like to read about the history of rose engine lathes.

The machine in the picture above is owned by a fella in New York who setup an organization with David Lindow to make it and other historical machines accessible for use. It is called Plumier.

Emiliano is right though. The Holtzapffels wrote 5 books (of the 6 they’d planned). The first 4 are more about traditional turning, and it is only the 5th which gets into ornamental turning. They are a great reference, as is Charles Plumier’s book from 1701 (it is in French, but there is a good English translation), as is Louis-Eloy Bergeron’s from 1792.

Kind regards,
Rich

 

[RichColvin]

20+ years ago I came across the concept of the "flow state", definition from wikipedia: In positive psychology, a flow state, also known colloquially as being in the zone, is the mental state in which a person performing some activity is fully immersed in a feeling of energized focus, full involvement, and enjoyment in the process of the activity. In essence, flow is characterized by the complete absorption in what one does, and a resulting transformation in one's sense of time. Named by Mihály Csíkszentmihályi in 1975, the concept has been widely referred to flow state across a variety of fields (and is particularly well recognized in occupational therapy), though the concept has been claimed to have existed for thousands of years under other names.

This may be what you are unable to put words to, Odie, although I'm not sure you are attempting to communicate about state of mind or exceptional work. Anyone can achieve a "flow state", and not produce anything exceptional or even average - the skills and/or ability may not be there, and no amount of perseverance will turn some into exceptional performers at a given thing. The exceptional can produce exceptional work rather easily within a given area, but may be near useless in other areas. While there may be some artistry in all of us, God didn't hand it out equally, just as He didn't hand out the ability to make millions playing football on Sunday to everyone. Yes, there is a factor of "God given talent", it's not the same level for all in all things.

If the end game is "art", the artist has a rather large head start vs those who never studied or practiced in the field, and who may not have much talent to offer in the "art" world. If the measure is knowledge of turning and capability to accomplish many things with a lathe and tools, it could likely be reversed. If the artist's lathe breaks, he/she is asking for help, while the craftsman determines root cause and fixes it without a second thought. Different strokes (talents) for different folks.

As to things being different a 100 years ago - I would argue today's exceptional are as good or better as then. What you don't see is the crap that was produced a 100 years ago because no one wanted to preserve it. Yes some can get wrapped up in "the next great tool", whether they are just "brand whores" or they really think that's what they need to get to the "next level". The latter are the one's that do need to focus on developing skills vs thinking it can be purchased.

I readily admit I am "art challenged". I don't know about the rest of you, but I've never been able to connect with "abstract art". Looks like a kindergartner through some paint on a piece of canvas. Years ago I was in the Kansas City Art Museum with my BIL, who has a Master's of Fine Art, and I asked him to explain abstract art. I got funny looks and shrugging shoulders. I look at some of the highly touted "art" turnings, and I struggle to understand what makes them so special. Personally, I will continue down my path of attempting to understand what makes one piece "art" and another piece just "nice work", other than the name attached to the piece of "art".

Doug,

When I was trap shooting a lot, I researched getting into the flow. It is a powerful thing, and really comes from your body really knowing how to perform the activities it is being asked to do, and the mind can focus on the outcome.

One thing that stands out from my reading, and is very relevant to wood turning, is to recognize when you are in the opposite frame of mind, call it the funk. This can come from many things: sickness, worry about something else, or maybe a tiff with your spouse.

One expert recommended that when you are in the funk state, you need to stop and walk away. Maybe for the day. The worst thing you can do is to reinforce those habits.

Kind regards,
Rich

 

[RichColvin]

Personally, I think "spiritual turning" can only be comprehended by a vey small percentage of turners.....maybe 2%. It takes much more than desire, and "stick time". It takes that "spiritual connection".....and frankly, it can't be had without a certain very specific level of spiritual-ness in the soul to begin with.

-----odie-----

Odie,

I think you need to add that it can only be comprehended by someone who loves the medium. If you don’t find wood one of the most amazing gifts from God, you will probably not get there.

Rich

 

[Aaron Harris]

Doug,

When I was trap shooting a lot, I researched getting into the flow. It is a powerful thing, and really comes from your body really knowing how to perform the activities it is being asked to do, and the mind can focus on the outcome.

One thing that stands out from my reading, and is very relevant to wood turning, is to recognize when you are in the opposite frame of mind, call it the funk. This can come from many things: sickness, worry about something else, or maybe a tiff with your spouse.

One expert recommended that when you are in the funk state, you need to stop and walk away. Maybe for the day. The worst thing you can do is to reinforce those habits.

Kind regards,
Rich

Agree-I make it a point not to turn tired, stressed or PO'd about something. Seems like a recipe for an accident or at least a bad catch.

 

[Leo Van Der Loo]

Leo,

Holtzapffel only made about 16 rose engine lathes. Most of what they made was used by trades people. But, Holtzapffel also made ways to adapt rose engine cutting to those lathes using tools like a rose cutting frame. John Edwards has a great history of them if you’d like to read about the history of rose engine lathes.

The machine in the picture above is owned by a fella in New York who setup an organization with David Lindow to make it and other historical machines accessible for use. It is called Plumier.

Emiliano is right though. The Holtzapffels wrote 5 books (of the 6 they’d planned). The first 4 are more about traditional turning, and it is only the 5th which gets into ornamental turning. They are a great reference, as is Charles Plumier’s book from 1701 (it is in French, but there is a good English translation), as is Louis-Eloy Bergeron’s from 1792.

Kind regards,
Rich

I don't know where you got your info Rich, but I have this info on the Holtzapffel makers of the rose engine lathes, and the number of lathes they made I tallied and came at at 2350, and Holtzappfel their numbers are that it is at least 2557 lathes.

This is a picture of no. 2456 lathe

 

[Leo Van Der Loo]

To add to my earlier post as who where the early users of the rose engine and ornamental lathes as they evolved from the early 1500 on to the the 19th century, a good short video does makes this a nice short watch.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0nkIzgXhEw

 

[Mike Krupsky]

During my working life I designed equipment, products and machinery to preform in many different environments, of many materials and precision. This was done to meet the requirements of the customers.

I enjoyed the work and challenge. Now I don't have to meet these requirements, I can take a piece of wood, look at it and make something I probably don't need but like the looks of. It's design can be changed on a whim (or catch). This is completely different and I don't have to please anyone. If I or my wife like it we can keep it, if not it can be given or tossed.

I turn for fun and the challenge (to myself) not for someone else's idea of what is wanted or needed.

Sometimes I even make things we can use such as bowls, stoppers and even parts to repair something.

Having fun and a challenge is what makes retirement work for me.

Stu

Stu, If that's not spiritual, then nothing is. Thanks

 

[Mike Krupsky]

With all due respect, and I mean that sincerely, I must disagree. I believe many of us, be we professional or amateur, are capable of that dedication and that it shows in our work. That little bit of soul we leave in each piece that is loved by future generations, makes us immortal

Amen

 

[odie]

Amen

You aren't the only one, Mike.......I can live with that.....and enjoy what I believe quite a few turners will never know, or experience!

-----odie-----

 

[Mike Krupsky]

You aren't the only one, Mike.......I can live with that.....and enjoy what I believe quite a few turners will never know, or experience!

-----odie-----

 

[Mike Krupsky]

It's not that complicated.

 

[odie]

It's not that complicated.

You are absolutely correct, Mike......

Once you recognize it, it's only a matter of practicing it, and refining it.

-----odie-----

 

[odie]

To add to my earlier post as who where the early users of the rose engine and ornamental lathes as they evolved from the early 1500 on to the the 19th century, a good short video does makes this a nice short watch.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0nkIzgXhEw

Hi Leo......thanks for giving us some insight into rose engine lathes.....

I was not previously aware of home-made rose engine lathes........here are a couple examples:

View: https://youtu.be/NmDqBDoYQ_U

View: https://youtu.be/C5BznZjSxWY

 

[odie]

You are absolutely correct, Mike......

Once you recognize it, it's only a matter of practicing it, and refining it.

-----odie-----

Yes, it's not complicated, but the real difficult part seems to be in the "recognition" of what spiritual turning is, and each individual may be equipped differently in the ability to facilitate that recognition. Apparently, (and in my opinion) it is something that exists outside of a conscious state of awareness, but maybe it's not at a completely subconscious level either. "Recognition" is what gives the individual the tools to manipulate that spirituality within us.....and that is the point where it opens doors to new possibilities.

It's kind of like riding a bicycle. Once you "connect" to the necessary union between yourself and the physics of propelling yourself while maintaining balance, you may not be able to explain in detail everything that makes this possible, but the fact that you can do it, is evidence that the union is there.

-----odie-----

 

[Leo Van Der Loo]

Hi Leo......thanks for giving us some insight into rose engine lathes.....

I was not previously aware of home-made rose engine lathes........here are a couple examples:

View: https://youtu.be/NmDqBDoYQ_U

View: https://youtu.be/C5BznZjSxWY

Thanks Odie, yes I do know about the simple setup "Rose engine" lathes, a friend of mine has been playing around with one he build, it is pretty simple stuff he does, got one picture of a piece heb did.

 

[RichColvin]

I made the lid for this segmented piece on my MDF rose engine lathe.

 

[Allen Mattsen]

Although I'm fairly new to this wonderful hobby, I find turning to be a meditative and spiritual experience. Much like when I pickup one of my guitars and dissappear into the music, turning allows me to take my mind off things and meld into the focus and creativity required to make something on the lathe. The connections of mind and hands, tools and wood (or other turning material) allows for a symbiotic experience that I find very rewarding for a variety of reasons. Plus, it gets me away from the kids

 

[Clark Champion]

I’m new to the Forum and excited to see postings like this on this kind of venue.

“Spiritual turning”?, or spiritual jogging, or spiritual singing, or even spiritual tool collecting….. don’t we all need or crave some sort of spiritual connection? Is the lathe a simple tool for complex people? Or a complex tool for simple people? Or can it be both?

I’m a primarily self-taught turner, initially inspired by a public demo in the park in Honolulu in the 80’s, but I learned to love and respect wood (and tools) from my Dad at a very early age. Spirituality, for me, is all about deeply personal feelings, attitudes, and a meaningful relationship with a power greater than myself. Perhaps each of us has our own way of practicing and expressing spirituality. And the expression of that spiritual relationship can change over time.

Many years ago, I taught mathematics. When I saw “the light go on” in the eye of a struggling student who had finally grasped a complex geometrical concept – I knew I’d done something right. Now, that was a spiritual experience.

Today, in my shop, a different kind of spiritual experience happens, and it happens between me and the wood – not every time but with greater frequency than before, as my skills improve. It is deeply personal and has nothing to do with whether or not you like it, or whether it shines, or whether “they” buy it, or it wins, or anything else. Its strictly between me and the wood. We’ve changed each other. Did I improve the wood, or did it improve me? Regardless, we’ve impacted each other in a very special way that no one else could do.

The tools are just the vocabulary.

Thanks, Odie, for the challenge to codify my thinking.

 

[odie]

I’m new to the Forum and excited to see postings like this on this kind of venue.

“Spiritual turning”?, or spiritual jogging, or spiritual singing, or even spiritual tool collecting….. don’t we all need or crave some sort of spiritual connection? Is the lathe a simple tool for complex people? Or a complex tool for simple people? Or can it be both?

I’m a primarily self-taught turner, initially inspired by a public demo in the park in Honolulu in the 80’s, but I learned to love and respect wood (and tools) from my Dad at a very early age. Spirituality, for me, is all about deeply personal feelings, attitudes, and a meaningful relationship with a power greater than myself. Perhaps each of us has our own way of practicing and expressing spirituality. And the expression of that spiritual relationship can change over time.

Many years ago, I taught mathematics. When I saw “the light go on” in the eye of a struggling student who had finally grasped a complex geometrical concept – I knew I’d done something right. Now, that was a spiritual experience.

Today, in my shop, a different kind of spiritual experience happens, and it happens between me and the wood – not every time but with greater frequency than before, as my skills improve. It is deeply personal and has nothing to do with whether or not you like it, or whether it shines, or whether “they” buy it, or it wins, or anything else. Its strictly between me and the wood. We’ve changed each other. Did I improve the wood, or did it improve me? Regardless, we’ve impacted each other in a very special way that no one else could do.

The tools are just the vocabulary.

Thanks, Odie, for the challenge to codify my thinking.

Thanks Clark, for your perspective.

I think you and I just might have a few mental concepts that overlap in a few significant places......and, if we could span a hundred years backwards, there might be some spiritual connections we share with turners of the past. That spiritual connection is really pretty simple, once you understand what it is......it's through it's application that tends to grow with an evolving knowledge. (The real problem seems to be explaining what that spiritual connection is through the use of the written word, so that it can be conveyed to others with real understanding.) Comprehension of that "understanding" eluded me for many years. There have been numerous times when I told myself that "I get it", but ultimately, I did not! I still don't know if what I know now, is anywhere near what my own spiritual connection can take me in the future......hopefully it will expand to a much more advanced state of awareness than is contained within my sphere of knowledge at this point in time.

Many of the tools of the turning arts have evolved to a great degree, but the basic concept of applying a controlled sharp edge to a piece of spinning wood has not changed at all. The spiritually connected turners back then knew something that seems to be lost in the current plethora of tools and devices that serve to partially, and artificially replace that "spiritual" connection......but, they seem to fall short of the total spiritual connection known to be possible by those same turners of the past who only had basic tools to connect the dots.....as well as a few turners of our time who can see through the modern obstacles that interfere with that vision.

-----odie-----

 

[odie]

Many of the tools of the turning arts have evolved to a great degree, but the basic concept of applying a controlled sharp edge to a piece of spinning wood has not changed at all. The spiritually connected turners back then knew something that seems to be lost in the current plethora of tools and devices that serve to partially, and artificially replace that "spiritual" connection......but, they seem to fall short of the total spiritual connection known to be possible by those same turners of the past who only had basic tools to connect the dots.....as well as a few turners of our time who can see through the modern obstacles that interfere with that vision.

I was looking at the thread for Emiliano's new hollowing rig, and thought "how hollowing has changed over the years".....to the point where just about any turner with reasonably honed skills can make hollow forms that are equal to what the "masters" were producing thirty years ago. We've gone from hand held angled tools, to braced tools, to captured hollowing rigs. Not only that, but we used to use calipers, and after using lasers, we now have evolved to video images that tells the turner exactly what the wall thickness is!

One very important point is highlighted in the quotation posted above. ^^^^^

It boggles the mind to consider how many different ways there are to sharpen a plethora of tool steels, with a plethora of gouge grinds......all being hawked as the greatest improvement since electric motors. The lathes have changed immensely, as well. Most of these improvements are for the better.....but, not all of them. Some only confuse new turners, and ultimately send them down a path that is pre-determined by someone else, and not by themselves.

I searched for this thread to reaffirm the written record of my beliefs that the most important things a turner can ever have, hasn't changed in a hundred years. These things, I call "spiritual" turning, and the concept was not invented by me......but, I recognize it as having been in the realm of turning experiences that have been available to turners since powered lathes and hardened steels were available.

Spiritual turning is something that just can't be taught. It can only be experienced......and once experienced, it then needs to be recognized in order to improve on it. You have to recognize it, to understand it, and you have to understand it to analyze what it is you've experienced. I probably spent thirty of my forty years turning, having the experiences, but not able to recognize the totality of what was happening, and then one day.....the light turned on! I'm now producing bowls I could only have dreamed of in the past!

-----odie-----

(PS: Sorry for charging the windmills again, Bill......please don't lock this thread, too.)

 

[Allen Mattsen]

I was looking at the thread for Emiliano's new hollowing rig, and thought "how hollowing has changed over the years".....to the point where just about any turner with reasonably honed skills can make hollow forms that are equal to what the "masters" were producing thirty years ago. We've gone from hand held angled tools, to braced tools, to captured hollowing rigs. Not only that, but we used to use calipers, and after using lasers, we now have evolved to video images that tells the turner exactly what the wall thickness is!

One very important point is highlighted in the quotation posted above. ^^^^^

It boggles the mind to consider how many different ways there are to sharpen a plethora of tool steels, with a plethora of gouge grinds......all being hawked as the greatest improvement since electric motors. The lathes have changed immensely, as well. Most of these improvements are for the better.....but, not all of them. Some only confuse new turners, and ultimately send them down a path that is pre-determined by someone else, and not by themselves.

I searched for this thread to reaffirm the written record of my beliefs that the most important things a turner can ever have, hasn't changed in a hundred years. These things, I call "spiritual" turning, and the concept was not invented by me......but, it was recognized as having been in the realm of turning experiences that have been available to turners since powered lathes and hardened steels were available.

Spiritual turning is something that just can't be taught. It can only be experienced......and once experienced, it then needs to be recognized in order to improve on it. You have to recognize it, to understand it, and you have to understand it to analyze what it is you've experienced. I probably spent thirty of my forty years turning, having the experiences, but not able to recognize the total of what what happening, and then one day.....the light turned on! I'm now producing bowls I could only dream of!

-----odie-----

(PS: Sorry for charging the windmills again, Bill......please don't lock this thread, too.)

Turning is definitely both a physical activity and meditative in nature, at least for me. It definitely fills a spiritual component in my life - and I'm just getting started! I hope to eventually gain the skills and time in front of the lathe (or at the end of the lathe) to be able to think less and just "do" what I intend to do. Creativity and spirituality in connection with nature, wood, and other materials is a hobby, lifestyle I'm glad to have found.

That said, part of a spiritual life is a "connection with people". The community is fantastic and despite my desire for solitude and wanting to be by myself at the lathe or in my shop, I hope we get back to a point where the two local woodturning clubs I'm a member of can resume in-person meetings! My area has gone insane again with regards to Covid cases and meetings have gone back to Zoom for the time being.

Fortunately, there are a lot of resources these days with which to learn and hands-on learning is the best, anyway. Thus, we move forward...

 

[stu senator]

There are many people in the world.

Some have artistic talent and can think of designs that please many people.

Some have technical talent and can master the use of tools they need to preform work.

In the overlap of these groups that we have artists that produce art.

Sometimes in the complicated world we live in we have people in group one (artists) who have the talent to direct people in group 2 to produce art. Think architects who depend on structural engineers to build a project.

As a mechanical design engineer I had a supervisor, a physicist, who could not visilise a 2D drawing into a 3D design. Yet he had a Nobel Prize in Physics. Different strokes.

Stu

 

[Bill Blasic]

After reading this whole thread I'm the odd man out as I find absolutely nothing "Spiritual" about turning wood. It is fun, it is fun and it is fun! Better than woodworking because of near instant gratification, it is fun! And that is me.

 

[odie]

After reading this whole thread I'm the odd man out as I find absolutely nothing "Spiritual" about turning wood. It is fun, it is fun and it is fun! Better than woodworking because of near instant gratification, it is fun! And that is me.

From my perspective, I think you are in the vast greater majority, Bill......

-----odie-----

 

[Roger Chandler]

I think one’s mental state as it relates to more esoteric observances and appreciation for what is actually happening in the “process” of turning, i.e, revealing beautiful grain, producing that perfect curve, some recognition of the sensuality of a form one is creating, all are contributing elements of the “spirituality” one senses as they are engaged in the process, even at times almost lost in the process.

For some, they never get the esoteric vibes, they just enjoy making, and using tools, etc. That is fine, and it is also fine for those who seem to elevate the experience to a higher plane…maybe that is part of what helps make an artist an artist? Something to ponder, anyway!

 

[Lou Jacobs]

For me, the “spiritual” aspect of turning is not so much in the turning, but through it, if that makes sense. I’m not skilled enough yet to turn without remaining largely focused on technique. What gives me a sense of the spiritual is feeling that I’ve done right by the wood - ultimately by the tree. I studied forestry and was trained to think of trees primarily as a crop. How to maximize yield and sustainability. Aesthetics and respect for the living beings were rarely if ever mentioned. I don’t know if that’s changed recently (my education was almost 50 years ago). I know that occasionally I create something that sings to me, making me feel I’ve brought out something special in the wood. I can tell which pieces those are, as they are the ones I go back to and just want to hold and feel. If I’m going to sell or give them away, I want them to go to someone who I think will appreciate them. That’s not the case with all my work, although, happily, it is becoming more common. When I think about it, I realize this has also been the case for me with small boats which I used to build pretty regularly. Some were just boats, and a few rose to a higher level. With those, I felt a spiritual connection.

 

[Dave Fritz]

This strikes me as relevant:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g95kqXqTVtU&ab_channel=TheKrenovFoundation


Flow, attitude, mindfulness all show in your work.

 

[Charlie Knighton]

I equate woodturning to sailing

 

[odie]

This strikes me as relevant:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g95kqXqTVtU&ab_channel=TheKrenovFoundation


Flow, attitude, mindfulness all show in your work.

Yes, absolutely, Dave.....

As I listened to Krenov, I found myself identifying with the points he made, over and over again. One after another, I was drawn into his mental outlook on general concepts, and the relevance of those concepts are indeed applicable to the art of woodturning. The ability of an individual to refine those concepts at a personal level is related to what I would call a "spiritual" connection.

Thanks for posting that...

-----odie-----