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Turning walnut and sinus headaches?

Brian Kopp

Brian Kopp

Joined
Mar 22, 2023
Messages
174
Likes
498
Location
Strasburg, VA
The last two times I’ve turned walnut bowls I’ve gotten a sinus headache that night.

I’ve never had a sinus headache before but when I pushed on the sinuses over my eyes and upper cheeks I realized that was where my headaches were centered. The first time it was just the sinus over my left eye but the second, last night, it was all my sinuses. Prior to this I had already turned a half dozen walnut bowls without problems.

I do have a box fan on high hanging directly over my head where I stand in front of my lathe and I thought that was blowing the majority of the dust away from me while I worked but I guess I’ll have to start wearing a mask and finally get my dust collector system plumbed in. (It’s just sitting - collecting dust lol)

Is this common with turning walnut?
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It is common for a lot of people. We don’t allow people to turn walnut or cedar at our club because of that. I am lucky it doesn’t really bother me but I still wear a respirator.
 
A lot of furniture builders that use walnut become effected. Also mesquite, Osage orange and mulberry can have the same effect on sinuses, caused by the oils. Just MO.
 
Brian Kopp said:
I do have a box fan on high hanging directly over my head where I stand in front of my lathe and I thought that was blowing the majority of the dust away from me while I worked but I guess I’ll have to start wearing a mask and finally get my dust collector system plumbed in. (It’s just sitting - collecting dust lol)


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Brian, your box fan isn't doing anything except blowing the dust all over the shop and into the air. Better to mount the fan behind the lathe with an air filter on the intake side - not optimal but better than what you now have. And DEFINITELY wear a mask or respirator!!!!

Also, you have some deep sanding scratches and what looks like some circular compression marks - probably caused from the bevel on your gouge. Put a secondary bevel (or multiple bevels) for relief. Just my 2¢ ... hope you don't mind.
 
Tom Gall said:
Brian, your box fan isn't doing anything except blowing the dust all over the shop and into the air. Better to mount the fan behind the lathe with an air filter on the intake side - not optimal but better than what you now have. And DEFINITELY wear a mask or respirator!!!!

Also, you have some deep sanding scratches and what looks like some circular compression marks - probably caused from the bevel on your gouge. Put a secondary bevel (or multiple bevels) for relief. Just my 2¢ ... hope you don't mind.
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Not at all! Thanks for the input regarding the dust AND the pointers regarding the tool marks.

I just started using a lathe in October and I just started making bowls within the last couple weeks. I fully realize that my finishing of these bowls is still subpar as I’ve been concentrating on getting the shape and thickness right more so than the solving the problem of tool marks.

I sand with 3” sanding disks on a 55 degree hand drill, going from 120 up to 400, and I was having trouble with this one getting the tool marks out.

I’m just a hobby wood turner and I give most of what I make to family and friends but I have already gotten a handful of commissions, mostly for my honey dipper jars, cooking utensils and dry goods scoops:
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Tom Gall said:
what looks like some circular compression marks - probably caused from the bevel on your gouge.
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I was wondering about these. I didn’t realize you could get compression marks.

I have a Sorby heavy inboard bowl scraper (great tool!) as well as a couple more inboard and box scrapers I’ve converted from extra skew chisels on my slow speed grander. I guess if I can convert extra skew chisels into inboard bowl and box scrapers, I can experiment with putting a secondary bevel on at least one of them too.
 
Nice job on the bowl Brian. I like the flared rim design and Walnut is such a pretty wood. Your techniques will get better with cubic shavings and experience, but you are doing very well. I have recently gone to a negative rake scraper on the bottom (converted from a heavy curved scraper) and it has helped a bunch.
 
What’s the general consensus regarding the Trend Airshield Pro face shield/ dust protector? Would that solve this problem I’m having?

I’ve been considering investing in one anyway and now that I’m enjoying working with walnut but having trouble with it, I’m more likely to pull the trigger on one than before. (I’m on a limited monthly income due to disability following multiple strokes so I don’t want to spend that much money on one unless they’re worth it.)

​

 
Another idea on the dust.....always wear a mask when turning dry wood and sanding......but, after the day of turning....might try a Nettie pot to clean out your sinuses.
 
Year's ago when I first started working with walnut, making furniture (flat work), it gave me the worst headache. Doesn't seem to do that now, but it does make my eyes itch. Walnut is known to cause reactions, even creating new allergies to other species that weren't there before. It's beautiful, but pretty toxic. I have many black walnuts on my property. Not much grows under them except a few weeds. Even they struggle.

I always wear a respirator. I chose the Peke Powercap over the Trend for the lighter weight and sleeker profile. Love that thing. Light, comfortable, and works. Easy maintenance and everything is repairable.
 
I have problems with both walnut and cedar. I simply don't work with either since it would be impossible to keep residue (esp dust) from accumulating in the shop area.
 
I have a similar allergic reaction to walnut. See this thread in health and safety: https://www.aawforum.org/community/threads/what-wood-do-you-avoid.19821/post-201836
But every once in a while I come into a piece I can’t resist. Six months ago an arborist friend called me to ask if I wanted a walnut crotch he had cut. I went to look and it was much larger than I had thought, but I could not say no. I got several pieces out if it including this rough turned platter. It’s almost ready for finishing. I’ll have to seriously suit up, PAPR, all the fans and dust collection running, etc., but I’m eager to see the grain in final display. 42EFCC15-0F51-4749-979F-0479FEECA2DB.jpeg
 
I also have some problem with walnut. I pieced my PAPR system together from eBay using a 3M air shield. Somewhat bulky, but very efficient/effective. I think if I needed to buy one I would buy the one Ken Rizza sells. Mainly because I want the lightest shield as I can get.

woodturnerswonders.com

SR 500/570 Air-Purifying Respirator

Due to the nature of respirator products, we cannot take returns of open respirators. The SR 500 system is a belt mounted Powered Air-Purifying Respirator (PAPR) which is paired with either tight fitting face pieces, loose fitting respirators or loose fitting hoods that protects against...
woodturnerswonders.com woodturnerswonders.com
 
Any respirator is going to be a purchase that makes you wonder why you waited so long to pull the trigger, at least it was for me.

I didn't want a battery and motor on my head (neck issues) - I went with the CleanAir from Peke Safety. Good price. The battery lasts me for several turning sessions. They have more headgear options than when I bought, but their "CA3" helmet is the same as the Uvex Bionic (with air stuff added), so it's familiar etc and easy to wear. Easy and comfortable are important to me as I would be prone to skip it otherwise (know thyself and all that).
 
Walnut is toxic both to plants and animals. I just purchased a particle counter that analyzes the air in my shop continuously. It was enlightening. You can have air that seems just fine but is very harmful. Particulate you can see generally will fall out fairly quickly. The really small stuff stays suspended. Please get breathing protection. A fan just stirs it up and keeps it airborne.
Pain is you body’s way of telling you to quit whatever you are doing.
jerry
 
Well, now you know why I don't turn walnut any more. It also made my skin itch. I just don't work it any more. Another wood I won't turn any more is Mimosa/Silk tree. Many woods can bother you that way, if not right away, then eventually.

As for the lines in the bottom of your bowl, they could be from a lot of things. One common one is if you have a sharp heel on the bevel of your tool. That will not be a problem on a convex shape, like the outside of the bowl, but can be a big problem on a concave shape like the inside of the bowl. Mine are all rounded off, at least half way to the cutting edge. I do use a shear scrape for my final pass, and have one video dedicated to that on You Tube. On some woods, a NRS (negative rake scraper) can help, but they are still scrapers, and are fine for sweeping across the bottom of a bowl, but not so good going through the transition and up the sides of the bowl.

robo hippy
 
I'll certainly be sad if I ever develop an allergic reaction to Walnut, Mesquite, or Bois D'Arc as they are some of my favorites. A well-prepared scraper will help you refine the interior of your bowls, including removing the tear-out that is visible on the sides.

Tim
 
Tim Hunter said:
I'll certainly be sad if I ever develop an allergic reaction
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As I understand it, many (some?) allergies are developed due to repeated exposure. You never know, but your best defense is PPE (respirator).
A few dozen years ago, I cut and sanded a lot of redwood (was making a spa cover and needed 1x slats but the 2x6's were cheaper - or some excuse like that). After a couple days closed up in the garage with the sawdust, I developed a very unpleasant redwood dust allergy. I think it's subsided now, but I still won't touch the stuff unless I have to.
I think walnut was starting to affect me when I got the PAPR - no issues when wearing it now.
 
I've also become sensitized to walnut and getting that way with mesquite.
Don't like wearing a cartridge respirator but seem to forget about it after a few minutes. As the cartridges are ridiculous, I whittled out the filter material and now put a piece of paper micro-fiber over the hollowed cartridges held by a rubber band. Hard to pick up chicks but it works.
 
I use a Trend Pro with good results and they are very helpful if you get a breakdown.

Allergies are usually due to repeated exposure but that is not predictable. Is it one or 101 that will KILL you ? No one knows so best to have protection .
 
I have mild allergies to some wood species. I use the JSP Powercap and love it. I had a Trend but found it to be too top heavy and uncomfortable. It would shift around if you bent over etc. The batteries would die pretty quickly too. I've heard that people modify it and make a remote battery pack to hang on your belt. I bought the earmuffs with the Trend and they were useless too.
One fun addition to your shop is a particle counter. It will tell you that there is always airborn dust in your shop unless you add some good filters / dust collector etc. It basically will scare you into taking some action!
I have a dust collector, overhead airfilters and just added a HEPA filter with activated carbon. I was hoping the charcoal might help with VOCs when you are finishing, but it is pretty ineffective. It sure takes out the particles though.
 
I have heard a few times of using old CPAP machines for air filtering. I think I would want a bigger filter on it, and the machine would sit on a shelf and you would be tethered to it. It could work. I do have 2 old machines I might get around to experimenting with. Switched to a mandibular advancement device, or mouth guard thing. It works far better for me, and is easier to transport....

robo hippy
 
I just ordered the Trend Airshield Pro for working with walnut - and for sanding in general. It’s what I could afford at present.

There are both positive and negative reviews about them but most of the negative reviews now are in regard to the weight of the unit on top the head. If I have to, I won’t hesitate to build a belt mounted battery pack for it. It sounds like that would solve most of the current complaints about them.
 
I got the Trend Airshield Pro and spent several hours using it last night while I was hollowing out a large walnut vase with a 3” forstner bit to hold a straight sided 3”x10” glass liner. So I was making a LOT of walnut dust last night.

At first it seemed to work fine, but after a couple hours I got another headache.

However, as soon as I took off the Airshield when I was done, the headache subsided, so it was a muscle tension headache from the bulk of the Airshield, not from walnut dust irritating my sinuses. I had no further headaches during the night while sleeping as I had with previous times when I worked with walnut.

So the Airshield did solve the problem of sinusitis due to walnut dust.

And I’m sure as I use it more the muscle tension headaches will resolve.

Frankly I was surprised how comfortable it was and how easy it was to wear for that long for my first time using it.

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