• May 2025 Turning Challenge: Long Neck Hollowform! (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Phil Hamel winner of the April 2025 Turning Challenge (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Paul Hedman and Donna Banfield for "Fire and Ice" being selected as Turning of the Week for 5 May, 2025 (click here for details)
  • Welcome new registering member. Your username must be your real First and Last name (for example: John Doe). "Screen names" and "handles" are not allowed and your registration will be deleted if you don't use your real name. Also, do not use all caps nor all lower case.

What's the toughest wood you've worked with for a finishing cut.......?

Odie

Odie

Panning for Montana gold, with Betsy, the mule!
TOTW Team
Joined
Dec 22, 2006
Messages
7,367
Likes
12,176
Location
Missoula, MT
I've worked some pretty difficult pieces of wood in the past.....but, when it comes to a cleanly cut finishing cut, this piece of bloodwood that's on my lathe right now is near the top of the list.

I've worked some bloodwood before, and I don't recall it being this tough to get a clean finish cut. It's true that individual pieces of wood may be different than the norm, but this one is far and away the toughest example of bloodwood to cut cleanly.....well, that I've come across, anyway.

Prior to this, I think the toughest piece of wood I've come across was a piece of very dry KD marblewood, but this piece of bloodwood has got that beat by a substantial margin. A bowl I made from Gabon Ebony was pretty tough, as well......but that one was far enough back that what I thought was sharp tools then, is a different than the level of sharpness I am capable of in the past 5 years, or so.......

Anyway.....what's the toughest wood you've made a bowl from?

I believe I've heard someone say how tough Lignum Vitae is.......but, you know, I've never turned any of it. :p:rolleyes:

ooc
 
The hardest wood I turn is mistletoe-burl mesquite - no doubt some of the exotics can be more challenging, but I can't get large, wet "exotic logs". But truth be known, it may be the softer maples (boxelder) that present the greater challenge - when turning a face grain as is shown in my avatar, the tool has to be perfect - no amount of sanding can overcome a poor cut.

When you say "finishing cut" I envision a very light, shearing cut with the tool at a steep angle. I would also guess this is the "final cuts", when the piece is very dry (6%MC). Further, the edge is not only sharp, it must be pristine.

From my experience this is where D-Way makes a difference. I have found that the M-42 holds a pristine edge longer. I've gravitated to the 3/8" gouge for final cuts - maybe the smaller size of the tool demands a more delicate approach.

John
 
Box Elder is challenging. The worst wood I've turned is Willow. Strings kept pulling out. I've never had trouble with what we call Hard woods. Meaning woods that so hard the tool doesn't want to cut them. Usually on these kinds of woods (Black Locust, Osage Orange etc) A good sharp tool always works I just have to take smaller cuts.
 
Most challenging is punky wood especially wood with great figure or historical significance that I can't toss in the burn pile
I have a hierarchy of techniques and wood treatments to get a clean surface without tearout.
Last trick in the repertoire is poly all 2000 and then I'm turning plastic...

Second John's dislike of willow it can be difficult to get clean cuts. I have only used it for natural edge bowls and in some classes.
Makes the student pay attention to bevel and sharp tools.


In the tropicals I don't care for wenge.
 
Last edited:
Can't say I have had the experience most of you have had. As John stated for hardness it would be live oak tools must be very sharp as tear out seems to never sand out. The worst for turning was Royal Paulina . This stuff is like turning a weed and just will not give a smooth cut, sanding is only solution. Sands nicely when dry.
I think as Odie said time and improved sharpening and turning skills have changed and that has changes my impression of hard to turn.
 
I did a large black willow about three years ago and you're right - teeny tiny cuts with pristine edge required.
It was also my biggest marketing mistake - two large bark inclusions come together and barely touch. I had delivered it to the gallery and had a show a couple of weeks later. During the latter part of the show, someone pointed out, "hey, that looks like the Sistene Chapel" - it sold a few minutes later. Could have sold for a bunch more.
You can see the piece at www.americanfineart.com website plus you can also see the mistletoe-burl mesquite pieces I referred to earlier - I get lots of practice sharpening on one of those.
John
 
John Tisdale said:
I did a large black willow about three years ago and you're right - teeny tiny cuts with pristine edge required.
It was also my biggest marketing mistake - two large bark inclusions come together and barely touch. I had delivered it to the gallery and had a show a couple of weeks later. During the latter part of the show, someone pointed out, "hey, that looks like the Sistene Chapel" - it sold a few minutes later. Could have sold for a bunch more.
You can see the piece at www.americanfineart.com website plus you can also see the mistletoe-burl mesquite pieces I referred to earlier - I get lots of practice sharpening on one of those.
John
Click to expand...

Some nice pieces in the americanfineart.com gallery, John.....

I see the Mesquite pieces, but can you identify which is the "Sistine Chapel" form in those 10 photos?

ooc
 
I have just been turning some Poplar bowls it's very soft requires the tools to be like those for willow sharp the end grain seems to fall out so sanding sealer helps, I have been using one made for Mdf .
 
The hardest wood for me to cut cleanly is willow plus it stinks and the few pieces I've tried had no character. No more in my shop. The most difficult all around to cut has been Desert Ironwood. Takes the edge off a tool quickly- kinda like trying to turn a bowl out of an 80 grit grinding stone- oh yeah.... It stinks too! But, it's so gorgeous I'm willing to put up with it's recalcitrance..........
 
Odie,
If you look at the top picture with me and the three pieces, the black willow is the back piece to my right. There are two bark inclusions that "seem to be reaching out to touch". If you have a hard time seeing a likeness to the Sistene Chapel I will have to agree. Then again, there was this potato chip on Ebay...
John
 
as I am reading you post I am thinking Lignum Vitae a friend brought me 2 pieces about 4 inches thick by 5 diameter but both pieces had a void almost down the center so I turned them into pen blanks it was tuff cutting and even harder to turn I love the color and the surface once sanded
 
Ironwood by far

Back in the late 70's while working Scittsdale Az. I met my all time pain in the butt, or should I say nose. A neighbor ask me to turn an urn for her dog. She wanted it out of an OLD DRY piece of desert wood that been in her backyard her dog's potty spot. Like a young no it all and several bottles of good local brew, I said yes. Hard wasn't the word I would use. It killed a band saw blade. My sanding started with 60 grit. I am glad that ashes don't care if the inside was smooth. My most used tools were in order were an OR-mask, Noxiema to coat it with and a grinder.
 
so far the hardest for me to work with was some kiln dried Wenge I had glued up for a segmented piece
no matter what I did I just couldn't get a clean cut without a bunch of major tear out, even using a razor sharp skew or scraper.
Will never forget that particular piece, frustrated and pissed me off so much, it ended up in my fire pit one night :D
 
Alby Hall sent me piece of 45,000 year old ancient Kauri. Made a beautiful box but it was the sanding not the tool work. Here Jackfruit and breadfruit and sausage tree wood round over your edge within seconds. They are not hard woods, just plain nasty. And as pretty as Koa can be its so unpredictable from piece to piece. Some you can get a clean finish cut. Some, no way. Rips and tears so start with 60 grit. We do have some rock hard woods that just will not take a great finish cut. Lots of tiny rips. And since the wood is so hard you stand there a while sanding. Kiawe, Ohia and high elevation koa. The high mountain koa is growing in a harsh semi arid climate. You may think lots of rain but that tends to drop lower. Thats why all the telescopes are up the mountain.
 
Well, maybe it was some old stinky cottonwood. Or maybe a 'dried in the attic for many years' piece of Koa that took multiple mistings with water to sooth it enough so I could start sanding at 80 grit. Well, then there was a piece of coconut palm that some one wanted me to make a bowl out of, in side grain orientation.....

robo hippy
 
robo hippy said:
Well, maybe it was some old stinky cottonwood. Or maybe a 'dried in the attic for many years' piece of Koa that took multiple mistings with water to sooth it enough so I could start sanding at 80 grit. Well, then there was a piece of coconut palm that some one wanted me to make a bowl out of, in side grain orientation..... robo hippy
Click to expand...

Reed,
Palm is not wood or a tree even though Florida and South Carolina both have palms as their state trees.
It is rarely a pleasure to turn. All this little fibers that are sort of like a loosely bound broom.
Need sharp gouges, bevel riding, and splash of CA here and there.

Al
 
Toughest wood

Bill Boehme said:
Neither is cauliflower, but it seems that Woodturners will turn anything.
Click to expand...

Some years back, here in Melbourne, the Exhibition Buildings were facelifted. Several Douglas Fir beams, well over 100 years old, were hawked around the local furniture makers who welcomed the chance of making stuff out of timber with a pedigree. Soon there was a chorus of screams from them because the timber had "case hardened" over the time and it blunted their planers & wrecked their bandsaws. I had a piece to turn a bowl from and I did more sharpening than turning. Hard as the hobs of hell.
 
Well, Bamboo is grass for sure. It turns well in end grain orientation, but hard to use a router on...

robo hippy
 
Punky wood

Hard wood can cut leaving a glassine surface. Siberian elm and black walnut both cut like a dream.
But Punk? When doing spalted wood it seems there's always a more moldy section probably where the mold got its toe hold in the first place, not that it matters, Fact is, sometimes the only way I can get a finish cut on spalt is to apply a few coats of a thinned lacquer and then try again and if it's still awful , then only sanding can save the day.
 
Raul McCai said:
Hard wood can cut leaving a glassine surface. Siberian elm and black walnut both cut like a dream.
But Punk? When doing spalted wood it seems there's always a more moldy section probably where the mold got its toe hold in the first place, not that it matters, Fact is, sometimes the only way I can get a finish cut on spalt is to apply a few coats of a thinned lacquer and then try again and if it's still awful , then only sanding can save the day.
Click to expand...

Hi Raul.......Ya, soft punky spalted woods are the other extreme, and difficult to get a good clean cut.....just the same. There is some very beautiful spalted woods, but seldom does any of the solutions (I've used the Minwax wood hardner) work to any appreciable degree for most spalt. Major sanding means you have to give up on precisely cut detail grooves, clean crisp corners, and matching intersecting edges, but still a particular beauty that is outstanding.

ko
 
OK, I have a new "toughest" wood today. I need to make a lid for a canopic style "jar" turned from mesquite. I rummaged around and found a piece of dark chocolate colored wood that I have had for more than five years. It's not very big -- about 5 X 3 X 2. I'm not sure if it's Texas Ebony or some tropical species, but I figured that it should be dry by now. It is as hard as the dickens and leaves a polished look as I cut it, but the really disconcerting thing is that when I left it partly done overnight, it had a bunch of really fine cracks this morning. I used some super thin CA to wick into the cracks, but I have a feeling that there will be a lot more CA needed before this piece is finished. The wood doesn't appear to have any moisture so maybe it is related to internal stresses being relieved. Anybody have experience with hard tropical woods?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top