Work In Progress - 5 Foot Cherry Vase

[Matt Hutchinson]

Hello all! I have only been a member here a few weeks, but I thought I would share my current project.

There is a local art competition here in Grand Rapids, MI called ArtPrize. I got accepted, and so now I am working like mad to complete my exhibit. The final piece can be viewed at the Grand Rapids Public Museum, Grand Rapids, MI from September 22 through October 10.

Photo 1.) Here's the 17" miniature of what will eventually become a 5' tall cherry vase.

Photo 2.) Laying out the axis of rotation on the cherry log.

Photo 3.) Mounting the log by screwing it directly onto the 1.5" x 8 TPI spindle.

Photo 4.) Balancing what will become the foot using a chainsaw.

Photo 5.) Here I am starting to make some good headway in shaping the outside.


This is the first time I have undertaken anything of this magnitude. I will be working on it like crazy later this week, and I hope to have the walls turned down to about 1/2" thick. It has to be ready for exhibit by Sept. 15, and I am ridiculously behind schedule. The lack of adequate drying time has me very uneasy.

More to come.....

Hutch

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

Short Video

Oh, I almost forgot. Here's a short video of the current progress.

ArtPrize Piece in Progress

Hutch

 

[Mr. Don]

Vase

I wanna do this!!!! By all means, keep us updated on this. Curious as to what you are going to hollow with. Good luck!!!

 

[alexc]

my gosh that is a great video. I'd love to do something that large one day, keep us posted.

 

[alexc]

why didn't you go with a faceplate and how is it being driven?

 

[Dan Oliphant]

Matt, all I can say is WOW, I started swetting just looking at the pics!! That's beyond sane young man.

 

[Charlie Knighton]

thanks for sharing, please keep us updated, offcenter.... should help with cracking....

 

[Bernie Weishapl]

Thanks for sharing Matt. Wow that thing is a load.

 

[WODAD]

Matt, I'm curious too, what will you use to hollow? Is it green wood, intended (finished) thickness, how do you plan to dry it? Have you done others this tall?

Frank D

 

[bsaks]

That is really cool. I have thought about turning something big but have never gotten the guts up to do it. Also I get nervous doing a 12" peice off-center that would scare the - - out of me.

Please keep us updated on your progress I am very interested in the process and what the finished product will look like.

 

[Steven Antonucci]

certainly ambitious

I haven't gotten quite so deep yet, but I do find that hooks are very good and predicatable a long way off of the rest. love to see the rig you use to hollow 5' deep...

BTW- why is the far end off center? I can't visualize it...

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

Well, I have been busy as heck working on the outside of the vase. I ran into a few surprises, but I think I have those all taken care of. *fingers crossed*

alexc - I didn't use a faceplate because I thought it would be easier to thread it onto the shaft. I thought it could prove difficult to true up the end perfectly flat and perpendicular to the intended axis of rotation.

Dan Oliphant - Yeah, the first time I turned that baby on I had to take some very serious time to determine if this was safe. After letting it run a while, and careful deliberation, I decided it was safe. I have my steady rest (a big steel ring) located at the off center end to act as a guard if something were to happen. Also, the video makes it look super scary cuz of the junky resolution/frame rate. At around 105 rpms it's quite steady.

WODAD - I plan on power carving away most of the wood at the bark edge, and finishing it with a 6' x 1.375" diameter boring bar. I may have to do a bit of hand carving, card scraping, etc to refine that part of the piece. At that slow speed with so much air to turn I could easily rip off the bark. Once I get into it a bit with the 6' bar, I have a larger diameter 10' long bar to reach the bottom. However, the bottom will not be at the foot, it will be at the smallest diameter. I plan on hollowing up from the foot about 16".

I plan on turning it to finished thickness, 0.375-0.5" thick. I would have rather liked to twice turn it, but I don't have time. Also, I don't think slight warping will be a visual or tactile negative because of how 'organic' this piece is. For drying, I plan on sealing only the outside with shellac, and stabilizing the bark and knots with CA.

I will surprise you all later with the answer to whether or not I have done a piece this big before.

Steven Antonucci - I have the end off center in such an extreme manner because it's the only way to get a slanted rim. Also, to make the rim even more slanted, the log is curved, and the long side (back of the vase) follows the curve of the log.

Thanks for all the comments! Now it's time to get back to work......lots of sanding today.

Hutch

 

[john lucas]

Thanks Matt. I would love to see more progress photos as you go. It's been very interesting so far.

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

Here's the latest progress. It doesn't look like it's come very far, but you're looking at about 22 hours worth of work since the other pictures.

Photo 1.) Here's what the blank looked like shortly after getting going.

Photo 2.) I actually get to use the pattern maker's tool/toolrest. Before I got too far along I wanted to true the end to mate with a faceplate, and I wasn't about to try it with a scraper!!

Photo 3.) And here it is all ready to handle the 8" faceplate.

Photo 4.) This was taken this morning, after I refined the curve to it's finished form. I think I had the bark edge completely stabilized at this point as well.

Photo 5.) Another view of the shape, just prior to sanding.


Here's another video. There's no turning on this video, just more explanation of the process. And evidently "neat" was the word of the day.

Video 2

I hope to shoot a video of some of the hollowing. Action is always more fun to watch.

Hutch

 

[Ian Robertson]

Looking good so far. Like the transition on the bark to timber.

You may find that the colour will stabilise when it dries a bit more and the shellac goes on.

We also do "little" work.

 

[John Torchick]

Vase

I'm curious- what lathe are you using for this project? How long is bed to handle a piece of wood for the vase? I'm also intrigued by the lathe in the thumbnail- brand and length? Custom?

 

[Don O. Jr.]

Looking Good Matt

Thanks for the updates.

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

My lathe was made my the Rollstone Machine Co., Fitchburg, MA sometime before 1890. It's a pattern maker's lathe, with about 23.5" inboard swing and can hold 6.5' between centers. Overall length is about 10'. It has a 2.125" shaft seated in bronze (plain) bearings. The drive system consists of a 2hp motor driving a countershaft that has the 6 speed step pulley. A 2" leather flat belt drives the actual lathe shaft.

It's an awesome machine for large bowls and heavy work. Doesn't do so well at higher speeds.

Here's a little more:

Photo 1.) Faceplate securely attached.

Photo 2.) In the previous video I mentioned how the sapwood had badly discolored. Here you see the results of my solution: 2 part wood bleach. It worked like a charm, and it looks natural, not "bleach white". I prevented it from getting on the heartwood by applying shellac along the grain line using a rag/pad, then sealing in the rest of the heartwood. After sanding and applying shellac to the whole thing, it's impossible to tell it's not natural. (Well, there is one spot that bleached to a purple-ish color on the back, but I like it. )

Photo 3.) Here the hollowing setup. It's a trapped bar design (which may not even be necessary) that uses a bolt on arm to extend into the piece. The boring bar is about 1.375" in diameter and 6 feet long. We'll see if I need the 10 footer.


Hutch

 

[alexc]

loving these picts matt, keep em coming.

 

[Charlie Knighton]

Matt,

thanks for the pictures, the first picture with the faceplate offset will help me in the future, it was pointed out to me to use lines to line up dogwood but your picture of offset faceplate helps, very rarely will one find dogwood straight, your cherry bends but probably can be found in straight 5' sections

thanks again

 

[jesus dante vidal]

Man! you're my hero!.




Congratulations from Argentina!.

 

[Lou Carbone]

That is some hollowing tool. Can't wait to see more.

 

[Dean Center]

That's some fine looking wood, now that you got the clothes off one end. I'm never going to attempt something like this, so it's fascinating to live through it vicariously. Keep the pictures coming!

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

While I am waiting for a friend to help me move the vase around, here's the latest progress.

Photo 1.) For the initial hollowing of the foot, I used a D handle trapped bar setup. I started out with a carbide cutter, but it was way too slow. So I then switched to a drill bit cutter.

Photo 2.) Here a picture of the double ended insert that goes into the end of the big boring bars. For the hogging out I use it with the drill bit, and for smoothing and final thicknessing I use the carbide cutter. (Carbide cutter not attached in the picture.)

Photo 3.) Here's a closeup of the drill bit cutter. It's ground back not unlike a bowl gouge, leaving a curved edge that acts as a hook tool. Awesome tool, got the idea from Jeff Nicol.

Photo 4.) Here's the carbide cutter. This is with it installed in the trapped bar system, not the big boring bar.

Photo 5.) This is the completed foot. Well, it's got further work after the rest of the piece is done. Later I will carve away the tenon and thickness the walls by hand.

This video has a segment at the end where I actually do a little hollowing.

Cherry Log Vase Video 3

Hutch

 

[Charlie Knighton]

thanks Matt, i had not ever seen or heard of the drill bit cutter except for timbles. thanks for sharing

 

[Steven Antonucci]

Photo 5.) This is the completed foot. Well, it's got further work after the rest of the piece is done. Later I will carve away the tenon and thickness the walls by hand.


Hutch

If you own a hook tool, you may want to try it for rapid cutting/removal/wasting of the inner material. They are amazingly efficient and I've used them hand held 18" over the rest. You could probably cut a pretty wide shaving and save some time.

Is the tenon on the bottom going into some massive chuck or will you be bolting it to a faceplate when reversing it? Looks great so far- finish out at 4' tall?

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

The drill but cutter actually works just like a hook tool. I was able to hog off some pretty nice shavings with it. The foot is being held in a chuck, and will be holding the piece for the rest of the hollowing process. It will finish out at 5 feet, not including the weighted pedestal base that hasn't been built yet.

I am now at the point of making sure everything is set to remove the long "arm" that you see in the last picture. After that's gone, I lose my ability to mount it between centers, so I am a bit nervous.

Hutch

 

[Mark Wollschlager]

I have also used a HSS ball end mill for hollowing.
Works ok most of the time.
Leaves a surface that is pretty clean.

mark.

 

[Charlie Knighton]

the blue tape, do you use it the keep the wood surface clean from the wheels of the steady rest????????

what kind of wheels do you use on your steady????

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

The blue tape is only there because the rubber roller blade wheels react slightly with the shellac. Normally I wouldn't have shellac on the piece at this stage, but this project has me doing some very odd things. Also, the hollowing steady is brand new, so I am not sure if the wheels will mark bare wood or not.

I have just finished using the 6' bar and have switched over to the 10 foot boring bar. I am currently working at 26" over the tool rest, and things are still going fairly smoothly. It won't be long until I need yet another bar. The bottom of the vase is at 51" over the tool rest, but I don't think that is gonna work. I will probably have to go to a welding shop and have them re-work the extension arm I had originally planned on using for this project. The intent was to have a rest that reaches into the vessel a good 16", but in its current state it's useless. Also, I am guessing I will have to have the next bar at about 2.5" in diameter.


Here's a video:

Cherry Log Vase Video 4

Hutch

 

[Steven Antonucci]

can you feel the bevel?

I have seen others use mills and drill bits to do this, and it looks like a pretty good way to remove a lot of wood quickly and cleanly. How do you sharpen the flute?

Also, can you feel the bevel rubbing? I like hooks for that reason, but I think the cutting dynamics are going to be a little bit different. With a bar that big, you could probably make a 1" shaving with a big hook, and save the mills for fine work.

Also, I love the jaws! That is a serious case of chuck envy

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

If you look at post #24 of this thread you can see the grind. It works quite well, but I haven't used a cutter like this prior to this project. I know when I was hollowing the foot I could be quite aggressive. At this point I have had to really back off to only a 1/8" shaving or maybe a tad bigger. Things have really slowed down, but it may be the nature of such deep hollowing.....I dunno.

I know this cutter can really hog when used on vessels 16" and shorter. Also, I maybe kinda feel the bevel rubbing. I definitely can feel the sweet spot, where it cuts beautifully, and my guess is that a portion of the bevel is rubbing.

Hutch

 

[Ian Robertson]

Looking good.

 

[Steven Antonucci]

If you look at post #24 of this thread you can see the grind. It works quite well, but I haven't used a cutter like this prior to this project. I know when I was hollowing the foot I could be quite aggressive. At this point I have had to really back off to only a 1/8" shaving or maybe a tad bigger. Things have really slowed down, but it may be the nature of such deep hollowing.....I dunno.

I know this cutter can really hog when used on vessels 16" and shorter. Also, I maybe kinda feel the bevel rubbing. I definitely can feel the sweet spot, where it cuts beautifully, and my guess is that a portion of the bevel is rubbing.

Hutch

I have to try this. I saw the cutter profile the other day, and I think it's more like rolling a bowl gouge to about 10 o'clock. The edge on a hook is usually flat, and can be put in shear. I think the drill bit is more of a scraping cut.

One more thing to figure out...THANKS!

 

[bsaks]

Matt, you have inspired me. I am going to try something similar, on a smaller scale, and do a vase that is 12" tall. I really appreciate the pictures and videos I am on the edge of my seat waiting for the next update.

Thanks!

 

[Sean Troy]

Matt, did you make your large boring bars yourself?

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

Yup, I made them a couple weeks ago. In fact, I have been working on a couple more yesterday and today. I just went to a local metal supply place and purchased some metal bars, drilled a 3/4" diameter hole in the ends (took quite a while manually), and drilled and tapped for set screws. I then made a reversible cutter holding insert. (Picture 2 on post #24 of this thread). They work great, and they are quite simple to make.

The current one I'm making is a 2.125" diameter x 10.5' bar. About 130 lbs.....talk about a pain in the neck! (and back, and shoulders, etc...) :cool2:

Hutch

 

[Ian Robertson]

Are you winning Matt?

 

[Matt Hutchinson]

Yeah, so I've been little lazy on the updates recently. I have been a little burned out.

Everything has gone ok, but the ride got very difficult in the last 10 inches. The piece has a bunch of knots at that point. So I had to hack my way through 4 long knots at 42" to 51" over the toolrest. NO FUN! But the walls are where I want them now, even though the inside surface isn't very smooth. I guess I will just have to sand the daylights out of it.

Photo 1.) Here's the beginning of the hollowing.

Photo 2.) I quickly ran into knots towards the rim. I had no idea they were there. Fun little surprises.....KNOT!

Photo 3.) Here's the boring bar I used to do the last 14" or so. It's 2.125" diameter x 10.5' long. At 130 lbs, it didn't get taken out of the rig much.

Photo 4.) And it's done-ish.

Photo 5.) Here's a better look down the center. At over four feet away, working the bottom proved challenging....just a bit.


At this point I am thicknessing the upper rim by hand using carving tools and a caliper. Also, I am cleaning up the inner surface manually using an IBEX curved sole plane, a micro plane, and a heavy round scraper (card scraper). My small amount of experience violin making is coming in really handy right now.

Thanks!

Hutch

 

[Don Leydens]

Amazing, Matt. You're a wild man! Thanks so much for the photos and keeping us up to date.
Don L.