I did a search on the forums and couldn't find any info, so here's my question. How does one decide to use a worm screw or a face plate?
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Worm screw vs face plate
- Thread starter David A Morris
- Start date
By what you are comfortable with, have equipment for. I think for real big pieces, a large faceplate is safer.
Well, I turn a LOT of bowls. I don't use either. I thought I learned it from Richard Raffen, but asked him and he couldn't remember. He now does his bowls with a tenon on the bottom which is sized to exactly fit his chuck jaws. For mounting my bowl blanks, I drill a recess on the drill press, and expand my chuck jaws into that recess. Most of the time, I will drill it deep enough so the bowl blank sits against the flange on the bottom of the chuck jaws. Since I do batches of bowls, I drill them all at the same time, and this is a lot faster than drilling for the screw chuck, or drilling the screws into a face plate, and unscrewing them later, and then threading the chuck back on. Same with the work screw. With the work screw, most who use it will have the lathe spinning and start to screw it on while running. I guess I could get used to it.... I would still have to open the chuck up and remove the screw or there are some that screw directly on to the lathe. Oh, my big chuck uses a 2 5/8 diameter forstner bit. I do use a recess on the bottom of my bowls.
robo hippy
robo hippy
Hi @David A Morris, here are a few Richard Raffan videos (amongst many he's posted) that should help you. But, I've never seen him use a multi-screw faceplate before, only single-screw screw chucks and faceplates converted to screw chucks. I agree with Alan, "really big" pieces, multi-screw faceplate. If you are on a 12-14" lathe, the single screw method should be just fine. (I don't turn big stuff anymore, a single screw works for me for everything.) Listen to what Raffan explains about the size of the bearing face of the screw chuck, that face is where the real work of cutting support occurs. He has a lot of videos, watch enough of them and you will pick up his work method patterns- you'll know what he's going to do next. 50+ years as a production turner, he knows his stuff!
Holding with the chuck with no jaw marks-
View: https://youtu.be/DV2T6oJgCi4?si=ahlRB066RHl2IWyP
Explains screw chuck options-
View: https://youtu.be/Vg79ogftGiQ?si=CSCu4WPEiDAp8ruX
"Throwing" a bowl blank onto a screw chuck (not a fan of the method myself, but you see him do it in just about every video so here is the method. I mount it with the motor off and spindle lock locked. I'm a chicken.)
View: https://youtu.be/cNAXwQZNMzE?si=d_wC42Jbg050B3xi
Making a wood collar for a chuck screw (worm screw) to use as a screw chuck-
View: https://youtu.be/3-P6qGkob34?si=HPuhLzIiUzJdyf7Y
Here's Tomaslav Tomasic (Raffan protoge') making a faceplate into a screw chuck-
View: https://youtu.be/ebcqT49xCNs?si=zzI2kiBruMseqIzt
Have fun with it, but be safe.
Holding with the chuck with no jaw marks-
Explains screw chuck options-
"Throwing" a bowl blank onto a screw chuck (not a fan of the method myself, but you see him do it in just about every video so here is the method. I mount it with the motor off and spindle lock locked. I'm a chicken.)
Making a wood collar for a chuck screw (worm screw) to use as a screw chuck-
Here's Tomaslav Tomasic (Raffan protoge') making a faceplate into a screw chuck-
Have fun with it, but be safe.
Thank you. That's a lot of info, and staying safe is good practice.
You're welcome. And the similar thread I started a few weeks ago, making screw chucks from faceplates.
What you see here is the ingredient list to make 3 faceplate-based screw chucks, including the 1-1/8" thick beech board, 8" wide.
On the left are 5" and 3" faceplates, 1-1/4" x 8tpi for my 16" Vicmarc. On the right, a 3" faceplate, 1" x 8tpi for my 12" Oneway.
I don't use faceplates really. But I enjoy watching Raffan more than rerun TV, and three quarters of his projects start with mounting a lump of wood onto a purpose built screw chuck (the Vicmarc 3-in-1 version for him). Since I have everything on hand, I thought I'd go with the faceplate style to begin with before...
On the left are 5" and 3" faceplates, 1-1/4" x 8tpi for my 16" Vicmarc. On the right, a 3" faceplate, 1" x 8tpi for my 12" Oneway.
I don't use faceplates really. But I enjoy watching Raffan more than rerun TV, and three quarters of his projects start with mounting a lump of wood onto a purpose built screw chuck (the Vicmarc 3-in-1 version for him). Since I have everything on hand, I thought I'd go with the faceplate style to begin with before...
I completely agree with this opinion. It's certainly more fiddly to install, but it holds very firmly. I've assembled a set of faceplates of various sizes, from 75 to 150 mm. As they say, there's something for every occasion.
For starting a bowl blank I usually use a wood worm screw in my chuck then bring the tailstock to support the piece until the outside is trued up and a tenon or recess is started, move the tailstock out of the way to complete the tenon or recess. This is safe as long as you stabilize it with the live center since even if the threads strip the blank can't go anywhere and by the time you are ready to finish the tenon you will be working at a small diameter of less than 1" or 25mm.
I do the same although I do own a couple of screw chucks and several faceplate rings, rarely use either.
DIY screw chuck out a chuck adapter and what we would call a Lag bolt
Attachments
I quit using faceplates years ago except for special projects. This, frame, for example, was tricky to turn because of the need to exactly cover the embroidery frame and no more (they didn't leave quite enough white space) so we made plywood disks for holding, fastened to a faceplate.
A friend of mine, however, uses a faceplate for every bowl.
I don't like the wormwood screws and only use them when there is no other choice.
However, the Glaser screw chuck is amazing - I think the precision machined screw is better than the typical wormwood screw. The multiple bearing diameters make it flexible for large and small things.
I've used the screw chuck with blanks up to the capacity of my lathe (20") and on bowl blanks up to maybe 6" thick. The only requirement is the surface must be flat. (When cutting blanks from slabs I like to flatten both top and bottom on the drum sander. For several reasons.) Obviously, the lathe can't be too wimpy for the weight and balance of the blank.
The screw chuck is great for these, blanks usually 8" to 11" across, 2-3" thick.
Just drill a 1/4" hole (in the top) with the drill press and thread the blank onto the screw chuck by hand. I like the Glaser chuck so much I got one for a friend and keep two at my lathe, the spare is for "just in case."
JKJ
A friend of mine, however, uses a faceplate for every bowl.
I don't like the wormwood screws and only use them when there is no other choice.
However, the Glaser screw chuck is amazing - I think the precision machined screw is better than the typical wormwood screw. The multiple bearing diameters make it flexible for large and small things.
I've used the screw chuck with blanks up to the capacity of my lathe (20") and on bowl blanks up to maybe 6" thick. The only requirement is the surface must be flat. (When cutting blanks from slabs I like to flatten both top and bottom on the drum sander. For several reasons.) Obviously, the lathe can't be too wimpy for the weight and balance of the blank.
The screw chuck is great for these, blanks usually 8" to 11" across, 2-3" thick.
Just drill a 1/4" hole (in the top) with the drill press and thread the blank onto the screw chuck by hand. I like the Glaser chuck so much I got one for a friend and keep two at my lathe, the spare is for "just in case."
JKJ
Gotcha!
I changed my approach about two years ago. I used to always use a faceplate. I switched to use a screw chuck 90% of the time when I rough turn. It's faster. Sometimes I can't get a flat surface or the wood isn't holding the screw well and I'll use a faceplate. My go to chuck for this is a stronghold with the screw that came with it.
I also do a lot of segmented work. That's always mounted on a faceplate and waste block because you work from the base to the rim and it's constantly coming on and off the lathe (making it hard to keep realigning a tenon).
I also do a lot of segmented work. That's always mounted on a faceplate and waste block because you work from the base to the rim and it's constantly coming on and off the lathe (making it hard to keep realigning a tenon).
Almost all of my pieces start between a cup and point drive center and a cup and point live center. If you keep the tail stock tight, the drive center won’t slip. This gives you the option of reorienting the wood as you begin to turn. Once you drill a hole, you’ve decided which side is going to be the top. Sometimes you’ll discover things as you turn (hidden figure, defects, interesting coloration, ring shake) that will make you rethink your approach. Good to keep your options open for as long as possible.
Worth noting that this approach only works for small to medium pieces. Once the diameter gets larger than ~10” and / or the height gets taller than ~8”, I’ll go to a large (1”) four-prong drive center or, if it’s an exceptionally large piece, an 8” face plate.
Worth noting that this approach only works for small to medium pieces. Once the diameter gets larger than ~10” and / or the height gets taller than ~8”, I’ll go to a large (1”) four-prong drive center or, if it’s an exceptionally large piece, an 8” face plate.
So many options! I use them all, and there are other options too, but mostly I use faceplates or RR's recess method. I try to avoid screwchucks. Multiple screws in a faceplate can give better support if the surface is not flat. (I rarely use the tailstock.) A single screw can strip the thread and come loose. Or the workpiece can get so tight that it's hard to remove - that's the biggest problem for me.
I don't find faceplates noticeably slower. A small impact driver runs three screws in and out in seconds. No pre-drilling.
I don't find faceplates noticeably slower. A small impact driver runs three screws in and out in seconds. No pre-drilling.
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I start all my bowls and platters with the worm screw, no matter what size. When I first started I didn't use the tailstock but one day there was a Oneway chuck on the lathe and rather than changing chucks I just used the Oneway screw and it wasn't very long that the screw broke. From then on I used the tailstock. I have used the same Nova screw for over 23 years and I have quite a few of them in a drawer.
Yes. The screw's job is to pull the wood against the chuck face, not support the work. If the wood isn't flat, the screw may be flexing. It is likely to fail eventually. As you say, the tailstock gives a lot of support. It prevents sideways movement, so there is less leverage on the screw. Even so, it might be prudent to pension off that ancient worm and give the next generation a turn. But I prefer to swivel the headstock when possible.
That's all very good information. Just the reason I joined this forum. Thank you all.
Every chuck comes with a screw chuck. I have a drawer full of them....
robo hippy
robo hippy
I start out between centers nearly all the time. This allows for avoiding defects and orienting the grain patterns as desired which can make an immense difference in the finished piece.
I usually grip the roughout with a tenon in a chuck, but for really big or unbalanced chunks a faceplate is hard to beat. Weak or punky wood gets a glueblock on a faceplate
I usually grip the roughout with a tenon in a chuck, but for really big or unbalanced chunks a faceplate is hard to beat. Weak or punky wood gets a glueblock on a faceplate
I typically use a smallish faceplate. 6inch? This is for new green wood for a bowl. I like it because the surface doesn’t need to be perfectly true. A slight gap makes no difference. I’m not afraid to use a shim for gaps if I think it needs.
Drive #14 flat or oval head screws driven with an impact driver (no pilot holes). With 8 screws the blank is secured well enough to give me great confidence, such that I don’t use tailstock support. No need. Easier for outside shaping and tenon forming.
Drive #14 flat or oval head screws driven with an impact driver (no pilot holes). With 8 screws the blank is secured well enough to give me great confidence, such that I don’t use tailstock support. No need. Easier for outside shaping and tenon forming.
Faceplate. Big wood?
The late Lisi Oland used a faceplate on her huge bowls. For those who like to turn big, take a peek at this video:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PMEJ7rirso
At 3:39 you can see one of her face plates and a different one at 4:20. If that was good enough for Lisi should be good enough for anyone. The one she showed me when I visited was larger in diameter. Look at 4:49 if you want to see how she cores these.
Lisi's place, studio, and shop was just a few minutes from John C. Campbell.
She was a wonderfully generous, kind, and friendly person.
If anyone wants to turn BIG, Lisi's way, I have a complete set of the Oland tools, still in the box. I'd prob trade for a piece of wood.
JKJ
The late Lisi Oland used a faceplate on her huge bowls. For those who like to turn big, take a peek at this video:
At 3:39 you can see one of her face plates and a different one at 4:20. If that was good enough for Lisi should be good enough for anyone. The one she showed me when I visited was larger in diameter. Look at 4:49 if you want to see how she cores these.
Lisi's place, studio, and shop was just a few minutes from John C. Campbell.
She was a wonderfully generous, kind, and friendly person.
If anyone wants to turn BIG, Lisi's way, I have a complete set of the Oland tools, still in the box. I'd prob trade for a piece of wood.
JKJ
Wood worm screw is faster. Faceplate is more secure and maybe a little safer for new turners. How big a hurry are you in? I'm in the group that feels faceplates are wise on bigger blanks (>13").
No hurry at all. The temperature has been in the 10 below range for the past couple of weeks and my shop is uninsulated and unheated.
For medium and small bowls I typically use a flat faceplate with some rubber drawer liner glued onto it, and push the blank into this friction drive using the tailstock. I have a couple of circular friction drives made up for this (~3” and “4-5”) with tenons turned on the backside. Makes it very quick and easy to put a friction drive in the chuck, push the blank to it with the tailstock and then turn the outside of the bowl and a tenon. After, reverse the blank to turn the inside. I’ve turned hundreds of bowls like this, up to 10” or so size.
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I cut 99% of blanks from logs with a chainsaw and mount on the lathe - no drumsander or bandsaw processing to get a flat surface. Blanks are mounted between centers using various spur or steb drive centers from 3/8” to 2”. I like it because either end blank center points can be moved around, or the blank flipped end for end, to take advantage of what shows up during initial roughing. Cutting/exploration proceeds until satisfied. Once an orientation is determined a tenon is formed, and a chuck is used to finish the piece.
I have a 16” swing lathe can go turn 29” outboard. Pieces too big to fit get a faceplate.
I have a 16” swing lathe can go turn 29” outboard. Pieces too big to fit get a faceplate.
Same here. 99% of my stuff is started between centers.
Me, too, but it was only after about 2 years of turning that I was able to do it—screw chucks and face plates prior to that. Training wheels are off. (Kidding—still a role for both screw chucks and face plates)
Glad you're kidding. A good Glaser screw chuck is still the most efficient way for me to turn a variety of bowls and platters. I teach the method and I know others turning this way.
As mentioned, I do start with a flat face. Flattening top and bottom with the drum sander works well for me. When I turn odd shapes and didn't know how or want to take the time to flatten the top face I'd go with between centers. But it's easy to flatten the top of almost any chunk with a chainsaw.
Note that using a screw chuck in end grain can be hazardous without tailstock support. I think this was mentioned earlier.
JKJ
While on the topic of good screw chucks, I quite like my Vicmarc 3-in-1 screw chuck (the one Raffan uses), which has an excellent screw and three sizes of backing plate built into the single unit. It is usually about $150, which I think is very good value.