Hunter Viceroy tool

[john lucas]

I wanted to show people how well this tool works. Especially for new turners but seasoned turners can use this tool also. I apologize for the sound. I will work that out for the next video. It's been a long time since I made a video and I have all new equipment so have to learn it's quirks.

View: https://youtu.be/puK60q0qjx8

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

John, I have been watching for a few minutes, very excited you were able to finish the video! I will send the link to our begginers. For some reason, one of them had the tendency of lifting one edge off, I kept telling her: flat on the toolrest... Great addition to your videos. I will now watch the rest, my popcorn is ready...

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

I wanted to show people how well this tool works. Especially for new turners but seasoned turners can use this tool also. I apologize for the sound. I will work that out for the next video. It's been a long time since I made a video and I have all new equipment so have to learn it's quirks.

View: https://youtu.be/puK60q0qjx8

Never mind the crack, perfect opportunity to apply a pewa patch, lol

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

I wanted to show people how well this tool works. Especially for new turners but seasoned turners can use this tool also. I apologize for the sound. I will work that out for the next video. It's been a long time since I made a video and I have all new equipment so have to learn it's quirks.

View: https://youtu.be/puK60q0qjx8

I’m not sure if our beginners are ready for a bevel rubbing cut just yet...

 

[john lucas]

Emiliano My latest student also wanted to lift one side off the tool rest. I guess it's a tendency to twist the handle in their hands that causes this. I just keep telling him to keep it flat and he finally caught on. I think it's the tendency for all new turners to grip the tool handle harder than they need to. We all did that when we were learning. Remember when you turned your first bowl. Your hands were worn out from hanging on. What I have been doing in the classes is at the very end before they leave I show them the bevel rubbing cut and the improvement in quality. I just want to plant in their brains that there is more to turning than scraping.

 

[Michael Nathal]

I am still not sure when you would use a Hercules versus Osprey versus Viceroy. If you are tilting the tool for a bevel rubbing cut, why would you use a tool with square shaft?

 

[Bill T Tucker]

Well done John...will forward the link to a new turner that is struggling. This may be the answer! Thanks.

 

[hockenbery]

Excellent video John.
Certainly an effective way for a beginner to turn a bowl with a short learning curve.

Some observations on the bowl gouge alternative.
A bowl gouge is much faster roughing and leaves a cleaner surface.
Advanced beginner/intermediate turner using a bowl gouge will rough a bowl that size in 1/2 to 1/3 of the time.
An experienced turner in 1/5 the time or faster.

you’re are getting a great surface with the bevel riding cut.
Surface is comparable to that which can be achieved with the bowl gouge maybe a little bit better than most get with a bowl gouge.

Not sure what the learning curve is for the bevel riding cut is with the hunter.

Also the scaling to larger bowls may be problematic for many turners.
A 15” bowl with the Hunter would seem to be a significantly larger challenge than it would be with a bowl gouge.

 

[john lucas]

I don't agree that a bowl gouge is faster. Maybe just a little but if you push the tool it will remove a lot of wood. It is slower when rubbing the bevel. You can take larger cuts with a bowl gouge and still get a clean cut. I'm not pushing these as an alternative to a bowl gouge. I love my bowl gouge. What is good about these is beginners can turn something with no stress and get it done pretty rapidly. Scaling up t larger bowls isn't a problem but again beginners don't do 15" bowls.
Micheal The square shank doesn't cause any problems when using it as a bevel rubbing tool. It's there mostly for the new turner who uses it as a scraper. What's the difference between the Hercules, Osprey and Viceroy. That can be tough. I use the Osprey almost exclusively as a bevel rubbing tool. The Hercules is great for roughing bowls. It takes a bigger bite (the big Hercules) than the Viceroy. I did an test one day where I was roughing a really out of round bowl and switched between the Hercules and 5/8" bowl gouge. The Hercules put less stress on by bad shoulder. I do have a large Thompson wieghted handle on the Hercules. My favorite tool for finishing cuts is either the small Osprey or the Small Hercules. The size of the cutter and the sharpness of the edge allow it to leave a cleaner cut than most other tools in my arsenal. I use one of those frequently when I have an area that want's to tear out. Sometimes when using the skew on spindles on woods like birdseye maple or fiddleback maple I get chip out of the grain areas. I can take the small Osprey and make a pass and it's gone. The Viceroy is a better overall tool for the beginning turner although the angle of the cutter makes it fantastic for Vases and hollowing out boxes.

 

[hockenbery]

I don't agree that a bowl gouge is faster. Maybe just a little but if you push the tool it will remove a lot of wood. It is slower when rubbing the bevel. You can take larger cuts with a bowl gouge and still get a clean cut

There’s a lot of positives for the carbides and I am a fan.

I think we agree the biwlmgouge is faster but disagree on how much.

A bowl gouge with an Ellsworth grind will take a 3/4” shaving in one pass.
The carbides take somewhere around an 1/8 or 3/16 depth of cut in one pass.
So the carbides need 4-6 passes to take off 3/4” of wood.

The carbides have the advantage of cutting in both directions so they can make something close to 2 passes for every pass the gouge makes.

One advantages of the gouge is in shaping curves it is easy for the gouge to cut varying depths in a pass as you shape the curve.

 

[john lucas]

Al I am a huge fan of the bowl gouge. don't get me wrong there. In the hands of an expert it is a wonderful tool. Especially for shaping, although I can use the Hunter Hercules or Osprey and get the same control from a bevel rubbing cut. The large Hercules has a 1/2" cutter and will cut full width. The Viceroy has the smaller cutter which won't remove wood as fast but the smaller cutter cuts cleaner than the larger cutters. Also more foregiving for the new turner.
The large flat carbide cutters like the Woodpeckers ultra shear tools will remove a lot of wood really fast. Still it's a different kind of shaving and throws it back in your face. With a bowl gouge you can control where the shaving fly which I much prefer. Tools like the Woodpeckers and EZ wood are mostly for new turners to get them into this hobby. The Hunter tools will also do that but many of them can also be used for more advanced skills. I showed a box interior that I did with 2 Hunter tools that you could easily leave unsanded or just hit with 600 grit. That's why I use them.

 

[hockenbery]

The hunters definitely work.
Also you will run into some folks who turn great with the carbides and really can’t use the gouges well because of mobility issues. Keep that in mind when you teach.

 

[Emiliano Achaval]

Emiliano My latest student also wanted to lift one side off the tool rest. I guess it's a tendency to twist the handle in their hands that causes this. I just keep telling him to keep it flat and he finally caught on. I think it's the tendency for all new turners to grip the tool handle harder than they need to. We all did that when we were learning. Remember when you turned your first bowl. Your hands were worn out from hanging on. What I have been doing in the classes is at the very end before they leave I show them the bevel rubbing cut and the improvement in quality. I just want to plant in their brains that there is more to turning than scraping.

I remember gripping the tools so tight that I had to stop to rest often. I was very impressed by the video, at the versatility of the viceroy....

 

[john lucas]

I've taught 2 blind turners. both were amazing what they could do. George was just in a Subaru commercial. What a fun guy. I have also had to change my teaching for people who have arthritis. Infortunately I'm getting there so may have to change my style in the future.

 

[Dean Center]

Slightly off topic, but one of the easiest enhancements for people with arthritis or other issues that reduce grip strength is a larger diameter grip. This allows increased use of the larger muscles. (as would really good attention to locking the handle to the trunk and turning with legs rather than hand/wrist/arm) Putting some tubular foam over the existing grip is an almost instantaneous way to do this. Turning new grips would be another and more fun way to go. John, your experience and skill allow you to turn without a lot of grip strength required, so you may be good, without any changes, for a long, long time.

 

[john lucas]

That's the cool thing about the Viceroy. It doesn't require grip strength. In the video I show using 2 fingers to control the tool. Bigger handles is a good idea.

 

[Jerry Maske]

Okay, where's my check book. Oh, that's right. The wife saw me watching your video and took the check book and hid it.

I've been watching the Hunter tools and WANTING them for some time. Now, that Viceroy REALLY has my attention. I do a fair amount of hollow turning and that looks like the greatest thing since sliced bread. What have you done to me?

 

[john lucas]

Jerry Just send me the check and I'll buy you a tool. Tell your wife it was for lessons.