Natural Edge Bowl (video)

[Daniel Perrone]

Hello forum. New member here. My name is Daniel. What little I know about turning it was self taught. I have a little shed in my backyard with a cheap lathe but I must say woodturning is one of the most therapeutic and relaxing hobbies ever. Here is a youtube video of a natural edge bowl i made. Wood is black locust. I found this wood to be a little hard to turn ( or maybe it was my rusty skills lol)

Daniel Perrone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqRu7AGmUJ0

 

[MichaelMouse]

Fun. You've got some courage, posting a video after the "apricot" thread. Or was commentary there why you showed the locust rather than the boxelder?

 

[Daniel Perrone]

Hi Michael, to be honest I had not read the apricot thread. I have been very busy this summer , so many things keeping me away from my little shop. I was so excited to have turned something and having a video of it I just rush to the computer to post it. I started with the Boxelder but i kept making mistakes and the bowl kept getting smaller and smaller. The wood was also a little punky and the bark kept coming off.

But it was worth it to swicht to locust as I like the way the bowl "turned out".

BTW, I just read some of the posts on the apricot thread and I learned / was reminded about the importance of safety.

 

[john lucas]

Good job. Your cuts seem to be well controlled. About the only thing I would suggest is trying to keep the center mark on the bottom of the bowl. When you started turning between centers you had a center mark. What I do is leave a very narrow tenon that still has this center mark on the bottom of the bowl. This small tenon will fit in the hole in the center of my chuck so it doesn't have to be removed while I use the larger tenon to grip the bowl.
The advantage of this is when I reverse turn the bowl I bring the taiilstock up to align the bowl with whatever method I use to hold it in reverse. This perfectly aligns the bowl and lets me finish the bottom more accurately.

 

[Daniel Perrone]

Thanks John.
I remember being very self-conscious about the quality of my cuts as I was being video-taped. I remember thinking " Why is this wood so darn hard to turn? "
Thanks for the pointer on the centering mark.

Ok, I have now read the apricot thread in it's entirety and i am begginning to regret having posted a video of my turning....Oh well...too late now....

To be clear I was not intending to teach anybody anything.... just wanted to share a video of how I made a bowl to the beat of cool music, just that...( and hoping for some pointers to improve technique like the one John just did)

 

[Bill Boehme]

.... Ok, I have now read the apricot thread in it's entirety and i am begginning to regret having posted a video of my turning....Oh well...too late now....

To be clear I was not intending to teach anybody anything.... just wanted to share a video of how I made a bowl to the beat of cool music, just that...( and hoping for some pointers to improve technique like the one John just did)

Don't be apologetic. I think that your video does a great job of reflecting your enthusiasm for this very addictive hobby. By watching it, I was able to vicariously enjoy how I felt when I first began turning and made my first "successful" bowl -- meaning that I didn't destroy it with a major catch. However, I am glad that nobody recorded my first few white knuckle efforts.

I think that you have done quite well for having learned turning on your own.

I would like to offer one suggestion about mounting the piece on the lathe. Rather than hitting the bowl blank with a mallet to seat the drive spurs while the drive center is installed on the lathe, do this off the lathe. Remove the drive center and with the wood lying on the floor, hit the back of the drive center with a wooden mallet or a plastic dead blow hammer. The reason for not doing it on the lathe is that each time that you hit the piece while it is on the lathe, it is damaging the bearings by brinelling the ball races. (Brinelling means putting little dimples on the races). There is also the possibility of bell-mouthing the Morse taper socket on the spindle when repeatedly doing this.

 

[MichaelMouse]

I would like to offer one suggestion about mounting the piece on the lathe. Rather than hitting the bowl blank with a mallet to seat the drive spurs while the drive center is installed on the lathe, do this off the lathe. Remove the drive center and with the wood lying on the floor, hit the back of the drive center with a wooden mallet or a plastic dead blow hammer. The reason for not doing it on the lathe is that each time that you hit the piece while it is on the lathe, it is damaging the bearings by brinelling the ball races. (Brinelling means putting little dimples on the races). There is also the possibility of bell-mouthing the Morse taper socket on the spindle when repeatedly doing this.

Surprisingly, Bill fails to mention that the spur drive is an unnecessarily dangerous way of starting the blank. With the geometry of a bark up bowl, the spurs must find most of their bite in the weakest direction, along the grain. Recipe for twist out and dismount. If you must use your spur, make a mild counterbore - 1/8-1/4" - to mount. That way it'll just twist and possibly make mush of the wood in the bottom (renewable) of the counterbore rather than fling and do the same to your face. The part Bill left out of his Newtonian first law is that a body in motion continues in motion in a straight line until acted upon by an outside force. Used to demonstrate it for the Physical Science kids with a tennis ball on a rope. Make it your gouge or rest, not your face that fulfills that part of the law.

I see you have a chuck. If you have pin jaws, consider using them to start. Mine are Novas, with no wood-mushing spurs, though others do have them. I prefer them when the recess must be shallow. Where I can get some depth, I use a pin chuck.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/Four-Quarter-Pin-Jaws.jpg
http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/Bark-up.jpg

 

[Ian Thorn]

I cant see if you are wearing a safty rated face shield or not ,agood idea when turning bark and untill the blank is balenced and firmly held.I have a 54mm bit and drill the side to be hollowed then hold the blank in the50mm jaws gives a good firm hold ,I had a lathe the same type as yours for about 12years and then repowed it 1hp 3phase ant verable speed . It lokks like you are enjoying the turning keep up the good work by the way the bowl turned out nice.

 

[Daniel Perrone]

Bill, thanks for the advise on not tapping on the spur drive. Even though my lathe is a cheap chinese import, it's all I have and i want to take good care of it.

Michael, I will google the "pin jaws" to find out what they are. Also look at your pics again. I usually chisel a bit of bark out for the spur to bite on wood. I guess the fact i was being videotaped made me forget that important step.
I did use a small faceplate and also the screw that came with the chuck but some of my pieces were unbalanced ( opposite sides did not match). Then i saw this video by Mike Mahoney and started using the spur drive



http://www.finewoodworking.com/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesArticle.aspx?id=30228

Ian, my next investment should be a face shield. I do have a couple of safety rated goggles to protect the eyes

 

[john lucas]

MM has a good point. I either chisel through the bark and cambium layer to solid wood, or use a Forestner style drill bit to drill though leaving solid wood for my spur center. I like placeing the wood between centers because it make it much easier to align the bark or grain of the wood to make a better looking bowl. I can turn a little and then readjust the tail center or drive center if necessary to properly align the bowl.
I like the two high sides to be the same height and the 2 low sides to be the same. I do this by measuring from the headstock. I also like the grain to be centered like a Bullseye and sometime have to adjust one center or both to achieve this.

 

[Rob Wallace]

To be clear I was not intending to teach anybody anything.... just wanted to share a video of how I made a bowl to the beat of cool music, just that...( and hoping for some pointers to improve technique like the one John just did)

Hi Daniel!

I enjoyed watching the video, and as others have noted, use of personal protection equipment is important - including when using the chain saw AND the grinder!

I agree with Bill, and was also going to suggest that you do not hammer the wood into a seated spur drive! Your headstock bearings will thank you, since they are not designed to take that kind of abuse. Drive the spur into the wood first OFF the headstock, and THEN mount the blank. This also reduces the chances that you will have a drive "frozen" in the spindle taper, which can sometimes be difficult to remove.

If you were a student in one of my turning classes, I would recommend that while holding the gouge (and most other turning tools), that you anchor your left hand ON the tool rest, which will provide some control against lateral movement. From what I saw in the video, your left hand is OFF of the tool rest most (if not all) of the time, and that it appears you are trying to control side to side position with arm muscle tension only - you will gain A LOT of control if you use the tool rest to full advantage by not only resting the tool on it while you turn, but also to anchor your left hand on the tool rest to provide some control against a laterally shifting fulcrum point while you cut. This will reduce body tension while you turn, and you will gain much more control for finesse cuts, as well as "hogging-off" cuts for removing lots of material quickly. It also means that you will be more relaxed while you turn, which reduces fatigue while turning for extended periods of time. You may be getting some assistance by having your upper arm on the tailstock or other places, but you may find that you get better control by anchoring the tool and your control hand on the tool rest itself.

I also suggest that you get some form of dust collection in place for when you sand - This is extremely important if you intend to do woodturning for any length of time. There also are other forms of personal protection equipment for respiratory health that you should consider using while you do your sanding, etc.

If you are a member of the AAW, you should sign-up to receive the bi-monthly mailings of the new "Woodturning FUNdamentals" electronic newsletter - another member benefit of the AAW started in January 2012. It is free and easy to sign up to receive this compilation of information directed at skill and technique development in newcomer and established woodturners. Have a look at the Woodturning FUNdamentals web page HERE. You can look at the current and back issues of the newsletter by taking a link from this page, and you can also ask specific questions which wil be answered by an experienced member of the committee in future editions of the newsletter.

Another bit of advice - see if you can get in touch with a local (or not-so-local) woodturning club and attend some meetings, become a member, and make use of the wealth of knowledge available to woodturners through the AAW and its affiliated chapters. There's nothing better than learning woodturning with a good instructor that can watch you while you work and suggest improvements that you can try then and there. While many instructional turning videos are good to learn from, nothing beats the personal, immediate feedback and critique to make you a better turner more quickly.

Keep on practicing and above all else, turn safely.

Rob Wallace

 

[MichaelMouse]

I did use a small faceplate and also the screw that came with the chuck but some of my pieces were unbalanced ( opposite sides did not match). Then i saw this video by Mike Mahoney and started using the spur drive

Not a problem using a small faceplate if you prepare at the DP. Or getting a surface for the jaws to bear on when using the woodworm, which I haven't used forever.

This shows a bottom being made parallel to a top, but you can easily do the same to mount your faceplate . Set the stop on the quill, then overlap with a Forstner or similar. A set of wedges holds bottoms pretty well, though if you've got an idea to go really asymmetrical, you can wedge one side up to get the effect.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/Forstner-Flat.jpg

Once again, the pin chuck/jaws are a perfect way to get whatever angle you like in one bore. They stabilize side/side with depth, while the faceplate does it with breadth.

Almost forgot, you mount the wedges and the wedged piece to a board which you can slide as required without disturbing the basic setup.

 

[Daniel Perrone]

Thank so much guys for all the useful feedback.

I became a member of the Ottawa club and attended a couple of meetings. Great club. I live more than an hours drive from Ottawa so it's difficult and a bit expensive to be able to make it to every meeting. But a new club recently started close to me, lead by an experienced turner. That's why i became a paid member of the AAW as it was a club requirement for liability insurance. It was great to join cause I found a wealth of material an the AAW website.

On the safety issue....man... I shudder when I think the way I started turning. I had come across, almost by accident, upon this very old lathe and very old set of tools ( all were carbon steel). So I just put a chunk of wood, grabbed the first tool I saw ( later I found out it was called the SKEW... LOL ) and put it to the wood......do I need to explain the rest ? ha ha...sorry I have no video of that one...
But now I had been bitten by the wood turning bug.

After several spectacular catches I decided I'd better get some instruction. Being isolated from other turners I used the internet to read/ watch/ learn what I could.

I find turning to be very therapeutic and relaxing. My job as a Nurse in the Intensive Care Unit can be at times very stessful..so much suffering, death..pain. Turning helps me deal with stress

 

[Thomas Stegall]

I made the same observations that Rob W. did and would make the same suggestions that he did. You will find your tool control will improve tremendously simply by mastering the fundamentals. John and Mike have also provided you with some helpful tips on mounting. There are additional ways to mount, each with their own advantages depending on your intended design outcome. The AAW and local chapter meetings will be your greatest resource in learning. Good luck

 

[Bill Boehme]

Surprisingly, Bill fails to mention that the spur drive is an unnecessarily dangerous way of starting the blank ....

MM has a good point. ....

OK, I got busted. Actually, what MM mentioned was my first thought about a dangerous condition and that was followed by the same thoughts that Rob had about holding the gouge. However, since I feel that lathes have feelings too, I turned my focus on the abuse that it was getting.

The pin chuck is a good very simple and low cost way of securing a piece of wood to the lathe. However, it seems to have fallen out of favor for more sexy approaches. I have never used a pin chuck myself despite MM's evangelism.

I don't recommend this for a beginner, but I frequently start turnings between centers. However, there are a number of precautions that I take first. The first is to balance the piece of wood so that it will not have a tendency to shake itself loose from the lathe. I do this by using a point at both ends so that the friction of the spindle will not mask out-of-balance conditions. Next I bore a hole on each side to get to solid wood and to also keep the wood captured. Next, I run the lathe a a very low speed -- about 150 to 200 RPM and sometimes slower. Next, I take very light cuts and make sure that my gouge is sharp. Finally, I position myself well clear of any likely place that the piece would go it it did come loose. I also keep the tool rest close and positioned to help deflect the wood. The first thing that I turn is a tenon so that it can be mounted on a chuck or faceplate and that is where my turning between centers stops. Even with the wood secured in a chuck, it is advisable to keep tailstock pressure on the piece as long as possible.

My faceshield is a combination breathing protection, hard hat, and faceshield (3M Airstream). It is rather expensive, but I am glad that I have it and my sinuses also thank me.